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Pitchforks and Torches
I miss Max Sawicky. But he's back temporarily this week, and today's sermon is about the origins of bubbles and other economic catastrophes. Is fundamental irrationality the wellspring of financial chaos? Nope:
What's missing from the meliorist framework of my fellow bloggers is the concept of Power. We're getting progressivism when we need populism.
....Let's recapitulate. Big finance ('BF') systematically dismantles regulation of its activities. BF takes taxpayer money and lobbies against the interests of taxpayers. BF shovels money to politicians. BF offers the sunny side of the revolving door to high-level officials in public agencies. BF provides a haven for its minions to make one-way/heads-I-win-tails-you-lose bets with other peoples' money. BF alumni construct new policies, in the wake of the meltdown, to make new one-way bets, with taxpayer money. BF luminaries walk away from this debacle with personal fortunes intact, if not larger, as well as high public office, followed by further personal enrichment. Even the former chief economist of the IMF thinks that government policy has been captured by the bad guys.
I won't pretend to have settled views about whether the financial industry owns the United States government lock stock and barrel or merely has a controlling interest. It's at least the latter, and after the events of the past year it wouldn't take much to convince me of the former. But whichever it is, I agree that irrationality just isn't a key factor in what happened — at least, no more than it normally is for any kind of organized human activity. At every step of the way during the Bush-era bubble, virtually everything that financial actors did was either (a) outright fraudulent or (b) cold-bloodedly rational in the short run even if it was disastrous for the rest of us in the long run. Where are the pitchforks and torches when you need them?





























Kevin, I don't understand
Kevin,
I don't understand how, in one breath, you call for more government intervention in almost every aspect of life, and in another, you acknowledge how fundamentally broken and corrupt government is. You can't seriously believe both of these.
Why do you keep advocating more government involvement when you admit this means even more control for special interests?
That's like arguing that
That's like arguing that because so many police are corrupt, having more police wouldn't be better. The answer is not fewer police; it is independent oversight of the police. Likewise, the answer to government corruption is not less government; it is independent oversight of government officials. How do you get that in the face of massive corporate bribes? Easy, take it to the streets like they do in other countries. Protests, strikes and boycotts can change politicians' minds in just a few days.
When our 'government is
When our 'government is fundamentally broken and corrupt' it is because of people working to prevent it from working in the first place.
Bush era bubble?
I'd suggest the Reagan era bubble, defined as 1978-present while allowing for the possibility we may be transitioning to the next phase. Maybe.
Question
golfer152212 Given your economic depth, what was it that was outright fraudulent ?
I've been reading on the topic of the "bubble" and I'd like to read your explication of the fraud part.
Enemy of the people
Everyone who plays golf will be declared an enemy of the people under the new populist regime, as well as those who doubt fraud was at the root of our troubles. You, my friend, are in double jeopardy.
Lou Dobbs
When the pitchforks and torches come out, will the mob be able to find Dobbs' 30 acre horse farm in New Jersey? Or are horses o k? That guy needs a new gig, this one was old the day after he started it. What a maroon.
Thank you! Right now I feel
Thank you!
Right now I feel like we've got a financial sector that isn't at all an efficient allocator of capital--they've degenerated into a bunch of freaking looters. And the government's role isn't so much regulation as it is issuing letters of marque.
This isn't fair. And it isn't sustainable.
Pitchforks
and torches won't come out until the media do more to inform the public about how all this came about.
I see flashes of it from time to time, but unless they hit it like they hit President Clinton, the torchbearers will never find out who screwed them.
Public opinion is shaped by broadcast news. And the people who run the broadcast news companies tend to socialize with the same people who ran the financial services industry into the dirt.
Toga, Toga, Toga...
Controlling interest (but oh what a controlling interest it is!, the whole finance system of the richest country ever!).
And golfer152212 has a point, why get our shorts in a knot when the fraud and corruption are either technically legal or seen as so?
Besides, it does have some consequences. In some cases it has put them on double secret probation (referenced out to CalculatedRisk).
Toga, Toga, Toga...
DWN
Source of our problems
For some mysterious reason, regular Americans don't care to look out for their own collective interest. You know, the whole "What's the Matter with Kansas" phenom. What the finance industry has gotten away with is amazing, but what is even more amazing is the lack of righteous anger.
And how did "populist" become a pejorative?
g. powell: "And how did
g. powell: "And how did 'populist' become a pejorative?"
Good question. I've stopped using it since I've come to realize that it's what I call a "Rorschach word". In other words how people interpret it has more to do with their own POV than the actual meaning of the word. Some take it as a synonym for demagogue, and others as "will of the people". Interesting psychological test, but a rotten word to use for clearly communicating an idea.
As for Kevin's sudden interest in "pitchforks and torches", I guess better late than never.
Pardon my cynicism
But what good would the pitchforks do? At best get rid of one crop of malefactors, but others would take their place.
The only thing we could do as average Joes is to vote with our wallets and quit patronizing these banking establishments, but even there we have little clout. Corporations are way larger business for them than we are. (Also, I'm not sure I can live without my Visa cards anymore.)
Deterrence?
That may be so. But the new 'crop of malfactors' would have a precedent to remind them that there may be limits in terms of what the average Joe is willing to tolerate, no? The historical logic is that the pitchfork exercise needs repeating every now and then.
Wish Max Sawicky were again
Wish Max Sawicky were again blogging. Anybody know where he got to?
pfft
Cancel American Idol. Blame it on Goldman Sachs. Then you'll see some pitchforks and torches, by golly.
supply and demand
While there were certainly fraudulent activities within the financial sectors, I wonder how much that fraudulent behavior was driven (no excuse) by consumer demand for more credit, bigger house, fancier cars, higher investment returns. It would be interesting to plot this demand signal versus the magnitude of the economic "bubble."
This demand may not be the single reason for our current economic situation, completely explain what happened. However, I'd bet there is a direct correlation and that consumer demand signal leads the resulting crisis and ultimate crash.
Anyone with ideas on how to collect or present such data? BTW, Kevin is not allowed to present graphical data anymore unless he uses a realistic frame of reference.
I think you'll find that the
I think you'll find that the demand for "free / easy money" is pretty much insatiable and common across all peoples. You could also flip this back the other way and ask how much fraudulent behavior on the part of the financial sector was driven by demand for bigger bonuses, bigger houses, ect....
I wonder too
I wonder how much that fraudulent behavior was driven (no excuse) by consumer demand for more credit, bigger house, fancier cars, higher investment returns.
I wonder how much bank robbers are driven (no excuse) to rob banks because that's where the money is.
Of course the finance
Of course the finance industry will blame the consumer, after all no one put a gun to their heads when they took out loans they couldn't afford.
But just as the modern food industry is probably responsible for the obesity epidemic, the finance industry is responsible for the over-borrowing. Both industries have legions of specialists who are tasked with pushing people's behavorial buttons to have them engage in actions that hurts the consumer but profits industry.
I would guess that most people reading this blog are relatively immune to the crap that industry throws at us, but most Americans aren't, and we all sufffer the consequences.
Consumerism in perspective
wbinmd,
In the larger perspective, to function 'correctly' the global economy does require ever increasing demand. In general that is the foundation to support the always expanding worldwide GDP which solves some of the innate problems with capitalism by making the pie bigger.
We've been told the global economy requires the American people to be big consumers. In that respect I think you can hardly blame people for doing what they have been told is not only right, but absolutely required to make the world economy function.
I can't say american consumerism caused the recent crisis, but I think the expansion of the US economy to a global scale has made such crisis much wider in scope.
I've said this before - the finite supply of natural resources will eventually slow the global economy, whether we want it to or not. In the meantime I think it is best to work on putting back the safety nets so that the rising tide does to some degree lift all boats.
Tripp
The political propaganda that is current academic economics
Max is completely correct. What happened when Keynes published the first comprehensive theory of Macro economics was that it became possible to model the overall economy mathematically - if you had the data. Since then government at every level, especially the federal government, has spent large sums of money collecting economic data for use in macro economic models. It's important that they do so. But the data is predominantly demographic data (relatively static over any short period of time) and accounting data which is the aggregation of the pricing results of large numbers of exchange transactions using money.
Remember that about the accounting data. There is no effective data collected on the power relations between the buyers and sellers, and nothing in that data addresses the equity of any of the transactions involved, either before or after that accounting transaction data is accumulated and aggregated.
Unfortunately it had a really bad side effect. Historically the discipline was called political-economics because in Marx' formulation the intent was to understand the materialism at the root of society, recognize the essential inequity of what he identified as the class distinction between property owners and the workers who had little control over their own lives, and change society so that there was more equity between people. The discipline has changed since 1936 into the statistical manipulation of the data the government collects.
It is now left to politicians to deal with the power relations involved in economic transactions, and since all the money belongs to wealthy capitalists, only the financial manipulations that can use accounting data are rewarded. The various economic models have become politically a great source of political propaganda, and the most widely respected economists in the academic world are actively discouraged from studying or speaking out on economic power relations unless it is to support capitalism as the perfect system and demonize socialism (which was designed to get government to deal with the power relations such as monopolies and such.)
This also permits the very wealthy in America to manipulate the government to both give them contracts in preference to competitors since they send many of the politicians into office, and also to get the laws changed so that procedures and taxes that give preference to the wealthy get passed. The most extreme example is the effort to eliminate the inheritance tax which is of no economic value to society, but works to maintain the wealthy families at their high (and mostly inherited) social positions. As Madoff and Stanford have recently demonstrated, control of large sums of money makes you immune to most oversight and regulation, even when the law is expected to take those actions. Both of those ponzi schemes were maintained way too long in spite of good reasons to be suspicious.
The result of the fact that the economics profession has become totally dependent on things that can be quantified is that today economists are very adept statisticians - and the study of power relations between people is actively discouraged in the profession. If you want to discuss the social value of economic society, the "economic" profession has nothing to offer except the assumptions they make when they create their statistical models. You see, there are no numbers that can be reliably and validly assigned to "equity" and "justice" or even to "humanity" that allows those thiings to be entered in the aggregations that make up the statistical models.
That's what Max is talking about. So was J. K Galbraith, which is why as famous as he got, he was never a very respected academic economist.
Notice that the Right's "populism"
is always directed away from financial interests?
I've been reading a lot of
I've been reading a lot of Gaibraith lately, and I recommend it. Many of his observations were spot on, and many of his predictions have come to pass. Granted much of what he said was more sociology instead of economics, but in that way he pointed out the huge blind spots that economic teaching has.
Sometimes, to this humble observer, our chief economists remind me of the CIA analysts who were instructed by Bush to repeat their analysis until they gave him the answers he wanted to hear. In this case it is the ultra-rich who are asking the economists to produce a result which always favors their interests. Whether this pressure is overt or covert, direct or indirect, obvious or devious seems to matter little. The end result is always the same.
The moneyed interests are satisfied first. Look at Goldman Sachs projecting, what, tens of billions of dollars in payoffs this year? You can buy a lot of politicians with that kind of payola. The rest of us don't stand a chance.
Tripp
Splitist
It seems the great victory of the libertarian right has been to split the commonality between workers and farmers in the rust belt, unions in the east and liberals in the west. All the while they enacted their master plan of running effective government into the ditch. What the hell are they striving for? Somalia? There's your example of a tax-free, non-government-interfering paradise.