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South Carolina's Lasting Impact
The true legacy of this election cycle's South Carolina slimefest remains to be seen.
In 2000, John McCain faced a do-or-die contest in South Carolina and got slashed by allegations that he had fathered an illegitimate black child and abandoned his fellow POWs in Vietnam. McCain lost in South Carolina by 11 points and his campaign never recovered.
This time around, the mudslinging occurred on the Democratic side. Clinton attacked Obama for supporting the policies of Ronald Reagan, a false claim, and many Clinton surrogates found ways to mention Obama's religion or past drug use. And Bill Clinton called Obama's record on Iraq a fairy tale, compared him to Jesse Jackson, and repeatedly brought up race, all while chastising the press for trivializing the campaign. Obama was baited into responding with his own nasty ads.
The result, even the Clinton campaign admits, is that the candidate who was once transcendent and post-racial is now very clearly "the black candidate." That may serve Obama well in a Southern state like South Carolina, where half the Democratic electorate is African-American, but it will take off some of his sheen in the eyes of white voters across the country. And that's why South Carolina's role in this campaign will not end until the February 5 primaries (and possibly even later ones) are decided. If Obama loses even a small share of the white vote in those states, he will struggle mightily to beat Clinton.
So how did Obama win tonight? As he said in his victory speech in Columbia, he had a "diverse coalition." According to exit polls, he took 80 percent of the black vote, but also 24 percent of the white vote (polls leading up to the election said he would win just 10 percent). He won big amongst voters under 30, but actually won every age group except the over-65ers. He won amongst the one-fourth of voters who identified as independents, but he also won big amongst the three-fourth who identified as Democrats. Fifty percent of voters said they attend church once a week or more: Obama more than doubled Clinton's support in that block.
And regardless of type and subtype, Obama brought people out. He won more votes today by himself than were cast in the entire 2004 Democratic primary. He won more votes by himself than Huckabee and McCain won together one week ago in South Carolina's Republican primary.
The Clintons may well have sacrificed this state in order to better their chances of winning elsewhere. Roughly 40 percent of voters said they made up their mind in the last week. Half of those people went for Obama, and one-third went for Edwards. Few went for Clinton. Those who said they factored Bill Clinton's campaigning into their decision went for Obama instead of Clinton. Seventy percent of voters thought the Clinton campaign attacked Obama unfairly. In short, people hated the negative campaigning in recent days. The Clintons, consciously or by chance, used South Carolina to color Obama as the "black candidate" in the eyes of voters across the country. And if that meant South Carolinians were disgusted by the way they did it, so be it.
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S Ash, R Levy - I may not agree with everything you say but you speak elegantly, and, as far as I can see, most factually.
David - just because Bush says something it doesn't make it so and the same for you - hope you're not like him - don't confuse him with the facts - his mind is made up.
Here's why Hillary!! from my POV, of course:
1. To end the war in Iraq. To combat terrorism, strengthen our military and care for our veterans effectively. To restore America's standing in the world and repair our alliances. To build a more tolerant, united America, working to achieve big goals again with a President who is ready for change and ready to lead from day one.
2. She is a moderate and is experienced in working with all sides of the aisle; can work well with global leaders; is intelligent and has good manners where it counts. She has proven herself a diplomat when visiting more than 80 countries, working with Congress and all interests. However you view Bill, he is a global asset to this country. She is the only candidate with enough EXPERIENCE to lead this country. You can trust that she will do and CAN accomplish what she says she will, because she has already demonstrated that
3. She is strong where it counts. She has learned from her mistakes, knows how to ask for directions and from whom, and has devoted her ENTIRE adult life to serving this country and its people. When she speaks she deals with the ISSUES not slimy muck and only responds ~ appropriately ~ when absolutely necessary to answer unfounded, erroneous and/or malicious gossip.
4. To achieve universal, affordable healthcare. To create good jobs for middleclass Americans with the right investments in modern infrastructure and in new, clean, energy efficient technologies that reduce our dependence on foreign oil and combat global warming.
5. To provide world class education from universal pre-kindergarten to affordable college for all. To promote 21st century scientific innovation, including stem cell research.
6. To return to fiscal responsibility, move back toward a balanced budget and safeguard Social Security and Medicare for future generations. To restore competence and end cronyism in government with a President who cares about and works for Americans who have been invisible to this administration.
7. MOST IMPORTANT TO ME. I believe that she will end our current "Disaster and War Economy" paradigm and replace it with a Universal Trade / Production / Scholastic / Artistic economy while making the other changes that will promote a NEW paradigm.
I believe she is the ONLY one who can make the necessary changes for our great nation. She has more than rhetoric, she has a strategy and the experience that will work ?
For an America that works for ALL Americans ? there's only one ? Hillary Clinton - President 2008 - Thank you Collea-Devi goetz
Thanks to Mother Jones its smart, fearless role in the media.
How can one read all these comments and not want to speak up! I guess one can't. As an environmental scientist and humanist (labels for orientation), I do need to put in a few points about SUSTAINABILITY (environmental, social, economic) as a bipartisan focus. The stability of our 'modern' society is precarious ? and has become more so since the 80s when, symbolically Reagan turned us away from climate change, planned parenthood, social sensitivity, etc. and towards the enclavism, the divine right of the rich, and the American Dream. Look at the world food indicators (per person); nearly all of them peaked back in the 80s. Since then, we have had 12 yrs of similar policies. Clinton did make a difference in many of these trends despite little backing from congress and he failed with others ? remember Kyoto, gays in the military, the 4cent gas tax. He did reinstate funding for Planned Parenthood, which was again withdrawn with the inauguration of GWB. This seemingly small act made a huge difference in the lowering of the rate of world population growth during the nineties. Also symbolically, the year 2008 was predicted to be the year in which we would see peak in oil production as demand overcomes supply (naturally there were other predictions). This is a complicated computation, but one can understand easily that the down side of this curve is much less friendly than the up side. Oil wars and price increases are expected responses to this problem. If one researches the data, there are plenty of other unfavorable global trends in food, available water, fish, desertification, immigration, arable land, deforestation, rich-to-poor ratios, sales of military arms, etc. It's bad enough to look at the fragility of our economy, and thereby the global economy. Neither may respond, as we would like, to simple knob twisting. History has taught us that failure to adapt to resource, cultural, or economic changes is a precursor to collapse.
What I believe adamantly is that the worst thing the US and the planet could have is continued policies of the present administration. A full sweep for the Democrats is the only hope, and this should be our primary objective. However, the leader of this sweep must understand the magnitude and urgency of the problem, must have experience in the functioning of both the US and international governance, must understand the dysfunction of our democracy (corporate influence), mush understand the dysfunction of the global market (no social, environmental, political accountability), not be a social bigot.
What I know scientifically is that this is likely to be our last chance to stave off a planetary crisis of incalculable dimensions. Considerable damage is already done (as Al Gore has explained about climate) but to keep the ship afloat we need an all-out effort, NOW. I realize that because of the learning curve, this is difficult to accept for persons who had less exposure to the information. This is why leadership, knowledge, and experience are so critically important in this election. Like it or not, the US is the best, and maybe only, country to lead us out of this predicament. Like it or not, the US is not at all independent of the rest of the world. Like it or not, we cannot solve an issue here and issue there, most of our problems are irrevocably connected. This is why accepting a practical vision of SUSTAINABILITY is essential to guiding a bipartisan reform of our infrastructure, governance, economy, and social attitudes.
If I could roll up Obama, Clinton, Edwards, Kucnich, and Gore into one leader, I would vote with hope and confidence in that one.
S Ash, R Levy - I may not agree with everything you say but you speak elegantly, and, as far as I can see, most factually.
David - just because Bush says something it doesn't make it so and the same for you - hope you're not like him - don't confuse him with the facts - his mind is made up.
Here's why Hillary!! from my POV, of course:
1. To end the war in Iraq. To combat terrorism, strengthen our military and care for our veterans effectively. To restore America's standing in the world and repair our alliances. To build a more tolerant, united America, working to achieve big goals again with a President who is ready for change and ready to lead from day one.
2. She is a moderate and is experienced in working with all sides of the aisle; can work well with global leaders; is intelligent and has good manners where it counts. She has proven herself a diplomat when visiting more than 80 countries, working with Congress and all interests. However you view Bill, he is a global asset to this country. She is the only candidate with enough EXPERIENCE to lead this country. You can trust that she will do and CAN accomplish what she says she will, because she has already demonstrated that
3. She is strong where it counts. She has learned from her mistakes, knows how to ask for directions and from whom, and has devoted her ENTIRE adult life to serving this country and its people. When she speaks she deals with the ISSUES not slimy muck and only responds ~ appropriately ~ when absolutely necessary to answer unfounded, erroneous and/or malicious gossip.
4. To achieve universal, affordable healthcare. To create good jobs for middleclass Americans with the right investments in modern infrastructure and in new, clean, energy efficient technologies that reduce our dependence on foreign oil and combat global warming.
5. To provide world class education from universal pre-kindergarten to affordable college for all. To promote 21st century scientific innovation, including stem cell research.
6. To return to fiscal responsibility, move back toward a balanced budget and safeguard Social Security and Medicare for future generations. To restore competence and end cronyism in government with a President who cares about and works for Americans who have been invisible to this administration.
7. MOST IMPORTANT TO ME. I believe that she will end our current "Disaster and War Economy" paradigm and replace it with a Universal Trade / Production / Scholastic / Artistic economy while making the other changes that will promote a NEW paradigm.
I believe she is the ONLY one who can make the necessary changes for our great nation. She has more than rhetoric, she has a strategy and the experience that will work ?
For an America that works for ALL Americans ? there's only one ? Hillary Clinton - President 2008 - Thank you Collea-Devi goetz
Thanks to Mother Jones its smart, fearless role in the media.
How can one read all these comments and not want to speak up! I guess one can't. As an environmental scientist and humanist (labels for orientation), I do need to put in a few points about SUSTAINABILITY (environmental, social, economic) as a bipartisan focus. The stability of our 'modern' society is precarious ? and has become more so since the 80s when, symbolically Reagan turned us away from climate change, planned parenthood, social sensitivity, etc. and towards the enclavism, the divine right of the rich, and the American Dream. Look at the world food indicators (per person); nearly all of them peaked back in the 80s. Since then, we have had 12 yrs of similar policies. Clinton did make a difference in many of these trends despite little backing from congress and he failed with others ? remember Kyoto, gays in the military, the 4cent gas tax. He did reinstate funding for Planned Parenthood, which was again withdrawn with the inauguration of GWB. This seemingly small act made a huge difference in the lowering of the rate of world population growth during the nineties. Also symbolically, the year 2008 was predicted to be the year in which we would see peak in oil production as demand overcomes supply (naturally there were other predictions). This is a complicated computation, but one can understand easily that the down side of this curve is much less friendly than the up side. Oil wars and price increases are expected responses to this problem. If one researches the data, there are plenty of other unfavorable global trends in food, available water, fish, desertification, immigration, arable land, deforestation, rich-to-poor ratios, sales of military arms, etc. It's bad enough to look at the fragility of our economy, and thereby the global economy. Neither may respond, as we would like, to simple knob twisting. History has taught us that failure to adapt to resource, cultural, or economic changes is a precursor to collapse.
What I believe adamantly is that the worst thing the US and the planet could have is continued policies of the present administration. A full sweep for the Democrats is the only hope, and this should be our primary objective. However, the leader of this sweep must understand the magnitude and urgency of the problem, must have experience in the functioning of both the US and international governance, must understand the dysfunction of our democracy (corporate influence), mush understand the dysfunction of the global market (no social, environmental, political accountability), not be a social bigot.
What I know scientifically is that this is likely to be our last chance to stave off a planetary crisis of incalculable dimensions. Considerable damage is already done (as Al Gore has explained about climate) but to keep the ship afloat we need an all-out effort, NOW. I realize that because of the learning curve, this is difficult to accept for persons who had less exposure to the information. This is why leadership, knowledge, and experience are so critically important in this election. Like it or not, the US is the best, and maybe only, country to lead us out of this predicament. Like it or not, the US is not at all independent of the rest of the world. Like it or not, we cannot solve an issue here and issue there, most of our problems are irrevocably connected. This is why accepting a practical vision of SUSTAINABILITY is essential to guiding a bipartisan reform of our infrastructure, governance, economy, and social attitudes.
If I could roll up Obama, Clinton, Edwards, Kucnich, and Gore into one leader, I would vote with hope and confidence in that one.
Get real. McCain will be our next comander in chief.
How does this win in SC leave Obama heading into Super Duper Tuesday? Did Billary succeed in defining Obama? The thought infuriates me; I can only take solice in his awesome victory speech. What a orator. The best since...dare I say it: Reagan.
In 2000, McCain was an extremely viable candidate. As a Democrat, he had my vote. By his unbelievable capitulation to the Bush machine and his subsequent support of 43, it will do him in. The Republicans are doomed!
Obama is the only democratic candidate with a chance of beating McCain. Billary's got to get out of the way - or risk being a liability for the party and ruining their legacy.
Obama is, indeed, a better orator than Reagan, by quite a long ways.
The Clintons are getting desperate, and its showing. OBAMA IS CHANGE....OBAMA 2008
I was looking at the boob tube. Obama was giving his victory speach in SC. I was shocked to see mainly white folks sitting behind him. Why would he set the stage in such a way? Did only whites attend the event? No! He is playing the RACE CARD! I have been to dozens of events such as this. Staff workers hand out posters and direct attendies where to sit and when to applaud. This makes my stomach turn. Wake up and smell propaganda.
The Democrats have got to figure out that Billary Clintons are screwing up a once in a lifetime opportunity -- and if the party isn't careful they will BLOW their chances at winning the presidential election. The people want OBAMA -- and are sick of the Billary Clintons willingness to do anything and say anything to get power.
Former President Clinton stated that Obama is just like Jesse HighJackson. Talk about race biting and the race card. The Clintons will win because they are use to getting down and dirty and a southern brawl. Poor Obama is at a disadvantage at this. He will lose, like all gentlemen in a street brawl. The Clintons have thrown the Blacks overboard, like the slave traders use to do to the uppity ones. The Clintons will rely on the new favored minority, the Mexicans. Oh, a few "Uncle Bills" will continue to support the Clintons just like the Blacks that support Bush.
So, Obama is "clearly" the black candidate. All along the Clintons cleverly planned to lose by a massive margin in S.C. simply to brand Obama as such. Wow. What, did Bill call last night, Johnathan? If anything is clear it is that your baldly pro-Clinton spin at the top is entirely deconstructed by the demographics data that follows. And you get paid for this? By whom? You might try some critical analysis next time, rather than cutting and pasting someone's talking points.
There, there - I know many people have never experienced a strong woman - Darlin's, now your gonna see what change is really all about -Us right brains have only just begun - the trenches have been dug- Hillary Clinton will - get it? - SHALL be President of the US for the next 8 years - Omama is a nice child with great ideas, but no idea what it takes to make things happen - the keepers of status quo are counting on that - with training under both Clintons especially the Big H - he'll be a great President - in 8 years - Hold onto your seats - the witch hunts tried to get rid of us and guess what - We're baaaaaaaack! Women of the World are watching - Beijing has not been forgotten.
Collea-Devi Goetz
Pleas DO print this!!!!! `
Collea, you are a racist to call Obama a child. The racists for years have referred to us as such. Shame on you. Without the Black vote, Hilliary can not get elected. 8 more years of GOP.
If bill clinton thinks he is a help to his wife's campaign he is out of touch with the people. Folks are just tired of his brand of politics. He has been as polorizing figure as bush 43 and he really ought to get of the campaign trail. He is really hurting Hilliary's chances.
Billary got nasty. Well, all Obama has to do is run an ad
showing Nixon(watergate), Reagan(Iran contra), W (Irak and WMD's) and Bill Clinton (I did not have sex with that woman) in the moment of lying. Then someone with a grave voice says
"Want change? Obama for President"
Collea u are racist to refer to Obama as a child he is a 43yr old man and a serious candidate for president and to try to marginlize him is just wrong. Just because Hillary is a woman doesn't mean she deserves the nod. Let her inspire the dems and stop all of the Billary attacks. If she can not inspire then she needs to quit
The swipes that the Clinton's take at Obama are laughable. I remember Whitewater, Travelgate, and the rest of the crap Billy was up too when he was in charge.
I'd mind my P's & Q's if I were him...It can get very nasty if all the stops are pulled out by Obama.
Regardless of the "polls" (we know who controls them), I like Edwards & Huckabee!!!
I was on the fence about Obama until during the past week. why, you may ask? I heard him comment that If he won the nomination, then the Clinton supporters would support him, but he doubted if his supporters would support Senator Clinton. I believe this is a veiled threat. All of this will do nothing to unite the Democratic Party and will do everything to divide it. I do not believe that Obama can continue to call himself a Democrat and threaten to pull his supporters away from whomever the party nominates. If he is going to take his marbles and go home, if he looses the nomination, then I say good riddance. We have three very competent candidates running for the nomination. If any one of them wins the nomination, I would hope and pray that they will unite to defeat the Republicans and return this country to some sort of sanity. And sorry, but even though I think others may not like what Bill Clinton says, many times he has spoken the truth--especially about the media stirring up the pot and drawing this whole nomination process down into a battle of female vs Afro-American, etc. etc. instead of what we as a people need to hear--what these candidates intend to do to remedy the mess we're in. We need to put a solid majority into Congress with a strong Democratic president so that the Republicans cannot continue to block what needs to be done to help the people of this country. If worse came to worse, a Clinton-Obama ticket or an Obama-Edwards ticket or any other permutation would be good.
Let;s just get over all of this. Enough already! WE need to beat the GOP! Not divide our own party.
One year from this week we will see our first woman president. In 2012 maybe our first African American president. Obama needs more experiance, just as badly as I need on on spell checker on my phone.
Levy, admit it, the Jews hate Obama because his middle name is Hussein and they know that he will not be their puppet.
This is ridiculous. Honestly Levy, were you ever going to vote for Obama?
Side note Latasha - don't use a last name to make your arguments - it is unbelievably sloppy and, in this case, antisemitic. If you're trying to talk about Israel than say so.
Back to Levy. In terms of dividing the party: Isn't it much more serious that Billary is trying to label Obama as "The Black Candidate" and use racial lines to win this primary election? Obama's comment was trying to say that he appeals to a broader coalition of voters. These voters might not vote for Hillary anyway. He's not saying: Don't vote for the democratic nominee.
Arjun, Arun Ghandhi got it right on the Washington Post's "On Faith" page.
Oh, for crying out loud. Now it's the Jews that don't like Obama because his middle name is Hussein? Can you for once use your head for something other than to keep your ears apart? I did for quite awhile think I would support Obama because of his oratory and because I do feel that we need inspiration in this world. If I were black, I would be insulted by the premise that I would only vote for a black man. Just as much as I am insulted by the thought that as a woman I would only vote for a woman. I am hoping that whomever gets the nomination will truly be a uniter. And if Afro-Americans think that the Jews hate Obama, then we are adding another dimension of hate and hostility to this process. Just what we need. So you probably think that I support Bush in the Middle East, too, don't you because as we all know, the Jews and the Republicans are all in bed together. Get real. I am really sorry that we can't have a rational discussion of views anywhere on the web. It appears that it has been highjacked by the intellectually impaired who only use the web to spout stupidity.
Rachele, the Democratic Party has built a party based upon "identity politics", now we are seeing the natural outcome of such a strategy, the deconstruction of the party over the scraps that are suppose to go to each "identity" group. Unfortunately, there is not enough to go around. The Republicans will be the beneficiaries. Since Wall Street has taken over the party, we are not allowed to discuss "class", only "identity politics" which does not endanger the economic ruling class. We see that our jobs are going overseas and we are sinking to a third world colony status where we export raw materials and import finished goods.
"As the Clinton campaign admits".
That wasn't an admission, it was a talking point. Why are you advancing it with a complete lack of skepticism, not only for the rationale, but for the source?
he's 46.
R Levy and Allen - thank you.
For the thinking impaired - Obama was asked by a New Hampshire voter WHAT would he do to MAKE the change he so magnificently in/aspires to (It's on one of the NPR stories- look it up if you must - it was right before the primary) He had nothing to say only sputter - then he stole Clinton's ideas and tried to make them look like his - Racist! I wouldn't elect anyone who spouts off rhetoric - no matter how inspiring, without a plan or strategy to back it up, anymore than I'd vote for two men that said they would use nukes on Iran - that is why he is a child - I wouldn't care if he was purple and 100yo - he doesn't know what it takes to be President and further, after his first mansion purchase he stopped being one of the "people". Hillary has dedicated her entire life to PUBLIC service - go to her web site - read - watch her speak- better yet hear/see her in person - way different than any soundbite - after having lots of money and loosing everything I owned two or three times - I know what it takes to live. She hasn't had my experiences but she knows what I've been through - She knows what it takes to keep a business - big or small - what it takes to get upon your feet after a fall - how to get legislation passed - is respected around the world and can clearly think with her entire brain - like multitasking - basically a right brain forte. She has many more qualifications for President and experience with the "people" that qualifies her to know what we need and imagine this... if she doesn't know and sometimes even when she does - she'll ASK - like asking directions - imagine that!! Bill is sweet and still maintains 60's values - but Big H doesn't need him to speak for her and he knows it - She does an excellent job. She is strong and won't run away from a fight when necessary but will do her best to avoid it - Drop the gauntlet and watch how Presidential she is, every time. Obama found that out when she spoke truthfully that he doesn't take responsibility for his decisions. He is a foolish child who will make a fine President someday - frankly I know lots of men who have never grown up and after being at what was then all male positions, I see how they cry foul when you give them a dose of their own medicine - I give you permission to start using your brain and maturity - truly, it's not something you can fake.
Collea-Devi Goetz
Collea,
Hillary has dedicated her entire life to the greater service - the greater service of Hillary Rodham Clinton. Her longest career was as a corporate lawyer. As first lady she made no lasting changes to the office except to remind us that, yes, the FLOTUS can fail at policy too. As a senator, she has no major legislation to her name, and as far as passing legislation, I'll try to not let you forget that before voting for the Iraq War she spoke before the senate about Iraq giving aid to Al Qaeda (apparently this was in the briefing she got on the National Intelligence Estimate, since she didn't bother to read it). She and her husband spent last week castigating Barack Obama for saying nice things about Republicans (never mind that he didn't say it).
Feel free to call someone names (like child, not a man), but when you try to make HRC into someone she's not - honest, experienced, and presidential - please understand that for GP's sake (General Principle), we have to call BS on you.
A lot of hot air from the blog community on this one. I get tired of everyone being so confident that they know exactly what will go down. All these assertions are without substantiation. In any event, I only wanted to say that it is inspiring to see Obama do so well with such a diverse group and in the south. Really, the tension between whether Hillary or Barack will get the final sweep is still with us, despite what happened. They've had fairly equal number of gains on each other. Sadly and honestly, I prefer Edwards to both of them, but see his chances in a constant ebb.
And enough with the assertions about whether or not America can vote in a black or a female president. It would take a group of highly dedicated sociologists to come close to knowing if that's true, certainly not a rag-tag group of individuals like us with nothing but our own experience AS INDIVIDUALS to go on. I get weary of people thinking they can sum up all of America in one glib statement. Of course, I am at home with a cold, so more cross and misanthropic than usual.
Thank you to the posters that brought the level of this discussion back to the issues at hand. Listen, I'm from NY. Do I support Mrs. Clinton? No. Would I vote for her if she was the Democratic candidate? Probably. If Obama wins the nomination, would I vote for him. Probably. The whole idea is to get the Republicans OUT. By the way, the one candidate that I do support wholeheartedly is John Edwards. He has been the only one who has come out with clear plans for what he intends to do once he is President. Check out his Health Plan that was way out there before HRC and Obama even started to talk Health Care. And if you watched the first few debates, basically Obama was following his lead on many plans presented. If the media had not pushed the "star power" angle of this race and limited themselves to either the "inevitability" of HRC and the "rock star" image of Obama, we may actually have had a real discussion of issues. The only one to really do so in every one of his campaign moments has been Edwards. Starting from New Orleans and moving on to Iowa and he continues to push issues and discuss the place that class, not race or gender, has on the lack of power of the people. It's a fallacy to just focus on race or gender as the reason d'etre for powerlessness. Class position causes the frictions between the have nots and the other have nots. It is in the interest of the ruling class to keep the pot boiling among the the poor, the disenfranchised, the races, the sexes, however you want to divy up the rest of us poor slobs. By dividing the lower classes up by identity, it fractures the potential power base that we would have as a united front. Doesn't anyone remember "Power to the People", "United we stand, divided we fall", "We shall all hang together or we shall all hang separately".....These are not idle sentiments. We need to stand together. We learned this back in the 50s and the 60s and yes the 70s. That's MLK's message---power goes to those who are powerless by the strength of their unity. He was not a beacon of hope just for African-Americans, but for ALL those who had no hope of a better future. He was for the poor, white or black, Asian or Latino, Christian or Islamic or Jewish, against war and the sins against mankind. Why did this message get lost and just become a "black thing"? That belittles the man and his vision. That is why we all need to keep out eyes on the prize--black or white. If Obama becomes the best candidate for the Democratic Party then we must stand together. If HRC does, ditto. If Edwards, does, again, ditto. The GOP loves all this fighting among ourselves. They practically salivate when they see this. And all those white guys in suits all stand shoulder to shoulder against the rest of us. Check out any scenes from any GOP candidates rallies and all you see are white folk. Are we going to break down into the Black Democratic Party, the Female Democratic Party, the Jewish Democratic Party....ad nauseum?
Paul, you are right to support Edwards. He is my man.
I couldn't agree more with Rachele, as this is part of my overall view of society and politics. Money is the great dividing line of opportunity and comfort, not color or gender or faith. And yes, we need to get around the GOP strangle hold on progress. Does anyone know of any precident for someone like Edwards actually coming through at the last hour, despite the hype to the contrary? Any dark-horse candidates in recent history to shock the established media by sweeping Super Tuesday regardless of the odds? I'm not being ironic. I can't think of one, but I didn't pay much attention to politics when I was a young republican at the beginning of the nineties. [Thankfully anyone can change.]
Lesson learned here, or perhaps just a reminder, never ever speak out about anything which can evenly remotely be twisted and used as being about race, even if it happens to be the truth. i.e. Jesse Jackson won in S.C. OMG! How dare Bill Clinton say such a thing. The point being made by Mr. Clinton, is a win in S.C. by a black person, is not necessary representative of a nationwide pulse. Oh, wait, prior to his saying that, no one had noticed that Obama is black, right? Just like no one has noticed that Hillary is female, right? Would it be just too much to ask for voters to look inside the package and examine the contents? Obama is highly unqualified and focusing on the wrapping of the package, rather than the contents is an advantage for Obama, but a big loss for everyone else.
"Obama is highly unqualified and focusing on the wrapping of the package, rather than the contents..." Sharon, please substantiate this claim. I want concrete bullet points.
Mr. Miller, "Any dark-horse", this is referring to the Black man. You whites just don't get it.
Leroy, stop distracting the conversation with your trolling. Is Edward's black? I don't think he knows this - perhaps you should give him a call.
Paul Miller: Bullet point one: When Obama was elected to the Senate from Illinois, he had weak competition, did not have to stand a hard test to qualify for the job. Point two: In the Senate, he has abstained, just given a 'present' on more than 130 votes. This is either not informed enough to make a decision or refusing to make a vote that could come back to bite you when you run for president which makes your just another politician at best, looking out for your career rather than serving the government. Point three; Has little contact with world leaders and little influence. Picked up the phone to call some of his contacts in Kenya to ask them to stop the blood shed and of course, they were not impressed as they are still busy chopping each other to pieces with machetes. Point four; Has chaired few committees of importance in the Senate. Point five; Has co-sponsored few bills and the one on ethics which he touted in one of the debates, is certainly one he should practice for himself as he had been in the Senate only a short time until he began to push for additional funding for the avian flu and he just happened to own $50,000 worth of stock in two speculative companies which just happened that two of his biggest financial supporters where major investors in and they just happened to be starting to develop a drug to treat avian flue. I could continue, but one of my pet peeves on these back and forth discussions are the people who feel compelled to write a book. Please understand, I like the heck out of Obama, what's not to like as he is a charming and motivational person? I just happen to love my country and I refuse to get caught up in the motivational hype. I remember when everyone was hyped about George W. and that certainly turned out to be just what everyone should have been looking for. Not!
Sharon, it is obvious that you are a bigot. If Obama was a EuroAmerican like Edwards, you would say these things. Just lay off of Obama. Wait until November, we may just go fishing if Hilliary gets the nomination.
Willy...Say what?????
McCain won't be our next President, neither will Obama or Hillary or Romney. I'm so tired of presidential candidates spewing all of these promises, and then when elected, it never happens. They just become hypocrites. I see that already in some of the candidates now.
Sharon,
PT 1 - He had a weak test when elected to the Senate. Yeah, and? He's not responsible for that. He had a strong test when he ran for Congress and lost that one. It didn't seem to destroy him to lose that race; he learned from it to become a better candidate later. http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/09/us/politics/09obama.html
PT 2 - He voted present 130 times. Out of 4,000 votes. Sometimes at the urging of Planned Parenthood to give cover to other politicians. Sometimes against his own bills. Sometimes to make a point about a popular measure that was going to pass overwhelmingly, yet he thought went to far. Out of 4,000 votes.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=18348437
PT 3 - He has little influence with world leaders. As a lone US Senator, how much influence should he have? How do you even measure that? You think if he becomes President the rest of the world will blow him off? And if he were to drop all active campaigning and move to a foreign country where he is not a native and doesn't speak the local dialect in order to prevent their civil war, could he count on your vote this fall?
PTs 4 & 5 - He has little senate experience. Compared to whom? I'm sorry, if you wanted experience Biden and Dodd have already left the race. Oh, and that stock purchase? It was purchased through a blind trust and eventually sold for a loss. http://mediamatters.org/items/200703090008.
During the week before the SC primary, I spoke to Bill and to Hillary after attending their presentations and heard Obama for the second time when he appeared at Clemson Friday afternoon to a huge crowd who stood in line for over an hour in the cold to clear security. I was undecided among the top three candidates still, but was surprised to get a message on my answering machine at 6:05 Friday night that was very negative about Edwards by the Clinton Campaign, according to the call. I was furious and called the Columbia Clinton office where I was told that they were not making the calls, but recorded the message I received and said they would do a news release to the larger papers about it. I found out on Sunday that there was an article in the Washington Post saying that the Clinton campaign did the calls Friday night to try to take the white votes from John Edwards. Although neither of the Clintons were in any way negative in the appearances I attended, I felt lied to about this dirty negative last minute campaign tactic.
Unfortunately, Regan the "great orator" was a fiscal and social disastor. I fear that Obama, while I admire him and his vision has offered very little of substance and is wearing rose colored glasses as far as the "change" ( a term I have really gotten tired of hearing) he thinks he can bring to Washington. I really think I see another Jimmy Carter coming.
Hillary Clinton did not make Obamma black.He(Obamma)just imagines himself as white and when he realized that people knew that he was black he cried foul on Mrs.Clinton for blowing his cover.He cant take even one little reference to his blackness.If he thinks this is bad,how will he hold up under the attacks from Karl Rove and the Republican machine?The Clintons will look like his fairy godparents compared to Rove and company.Also he will not get by without answering the important questions when he debates with the Republicans.No stealing their Ideas like he has from Edwards and Ms.Clinton.Mr.Clinton has every right to campaign for his wife.If Obamma cant take it he should get out of the race.This is American politics not a garden party for his benifit alone.
I think you are absolutely right.
Wow--if everyone who says "I prefer Edwards, really" VOTES for him in their primary this could be a whole new ballgame after 2/5. Besides this blog, I've heard that comment from about five people in the past few days. Why isn't the media even considering Edwards as a contender? Could it be that the media is very largely owned by the kind of corporate overlords Edwards excoriates? Hey! Do I smell coffee???
Hillary didn't make Obama black, but it was the Clintons who used the Southern Strategy the Republicans are so fond of to label his as a 'black candidate'. Do I want a Democrat who uses the Republican playbook on other Democrats? That's a traitor.
Furthermore, Hillary cannot win. She's alienated the black vote the very base of the Democratic party.
All these new Democrats that are coming out of the woodwork aren't coming out for her, all these new voters are voting for Obama.
This 'new generation' of democrats are inspired by Obama. To deny him the nomination is to disenfranchise an entire future generation of leaders and voters.
If the Billary is nominated 1) Republicans will come out enmasse 2) Independents will all swing for McCain 3) The blacks won't vote due to disenfranchisement from the Southern Strategy used by Billary 4) The new generation that is topping the polls with record numbers will lose hope and not vote.
Get it straight, Obama does not have the establishment the Clintons do, and he doesn't play by the most foul Republican playbook. He can unite. His message is consistent.
When CHANGE was the big byword out of Iowa, Hillary said 'Change, Im change'. When UNITY Was the byword out of Iowa, Hillary said she was a uniter.
Then they used the Rove playbook to make Obama look more black. Is that uniting? That makes Democrats angry.
Giving her the nomination would the be the worst thing to do now that the Clintons have shown a side of themselves most Democrats didn't know was there. Now that they do, there will be no excitement, no hope, no unity, no black vote, no independents - and no record turnouts.