Christian Right Group: "Export Homosexuals"

We must not forget our dear Karl Marx who condemned the sexual freedom advocated by Fourier and Saint-Simon as a relapse into a "bestial" state of "universal prostitution". Engels condemned homosexuality among men of ancient Greece in two separate passages of The Origin of the Family, Private Property, and the State, describing it as "morally deteriorated", "abominable", "loathsome" and "degrading". Marx apparently shared Engels' views, writing that "the relation of man to woman is the most natural relation of human being to human being" and describing the author of a text promoting sexual freedoms as "that queer prick" ("Schwanzschwulen"). According to the socialist writers Hekma, Oosterhuis and Steakley, Marx and Engels saw any form of sexuality outside of a monogamous heterosexual marriage as a kind of degeneracy fostered by capitalism, which could be cured by socialism. According to Engels, "natural moral principles" would flourish in the socialist future, when (heterosexual) "monogamy, instead of declining, finally becomes a reality ? for the man as well, and homosexuality would simply disappear.
August Bebel's Woman under Socialism (1879), the "single work dealing with sexuality most widely read by rank-and-file members of the SPD," was even more explicit in warning socialists of the dangers of same-sex love. Bebel attributed "this crime against nature" in both men and women to sexual indulgence and excess, describing it as an upper-class, metropolitan and foreign vice.

We must not forget our dear Karl Marx who condemned the sexual freedom advocated by Fourier and Saint-Simon as a relapse into a "bestial" state of "universal prostitution". Engels condemned homosexuality among men of ancient Greece in two separate passages of The Origin of the Family, Private Property, and the State, describing it as "morally deteriorated", "abominable", "loathsome" and "degrading". Marx apparently shared Engels' views, writing that "the relation of man to woman is the most natural relation of human being to human being" and describing the author of a text promoting sexual freedoms as "that queer prick" ("Schwanzschwulen"). According to the socialist writers Hekma, Oosterhuis and Steakley, Marx and Engels saw any form of sexuality outside of a monogamous heterosexual marriage as a kind of degeneracy fostered by capitalism, which could be cured by socialism. According to Engels, "natural moral principles" would flourish in the socialist future, when (heterosexual) "monogamy, instead of declining, finally becomes a reality ? for the man as well, and homosexuality would simply disappear.
August Bebel's Woman under Socialism (1879), the "single work dealing with sexuality most widely read by rank-and-file members of the SPD," was even more explicit in warning socialists of the dangers of same-sex love. Bebel attributed "this crime against nature" in both men and women to sexual indulgence and excess, describing it as an upper-class, metropolitan and foreign vice.

Someone needs to tell these folks that it's easter and the cross will be empty soon. . .they can climb back up.

Let's not forget these remarks in November...no more right wing, radical christians in the White House, ok?

I'm not so sure about the "losing most of the clergy" bit. I appreciate the endless hypocrisies of many church leaders, but sex crimes are not linked to sexual orientation, so most of them wouldn't be shipped out except for the likes of Ted Haggard, but they'd probably keep him too since he is "cured." (shudder)

Yeah, James Dobson and fam sure know how to keep it classy. They obviously are keeping love in their hearts.

Well, but it is somewhat safe to say a lot of Christian politicians would now have to go to Canada and Mexico to play footsie in bathrooms and grovel at the feet of strangers in parks.
Silverlucie - It's a deal. Can we stop with all the 'if Clinton doesn't get nominated, I'm giving my vote to McCain or Nader' nonsense? And I've heard this comment concerning whether of not Obama gets in, as well. Vote for whatever Dem we get because I cannot believe it will be worse than any rightie in today's world. [Except I hope it's Obama.]

Israel Knesset Member Nissim Ze'ev recently proposed establishing "rehabilitation centers" to suppress the sexual tendencies of gay people.
"The government should initiate this; these people are dangerous and we must keep an eye on them," he said as the High Court discussed whether to cancel the Jerusalem gay pride parade due to the firefighters' slow-down strike. "If such a center is built, many of them will flock to it in order to help themselves. " Ze'ev added that gay people must be made aware of "how their lifestyle is destroying our existence". Zeev went as far as comparing the gay movement to a "plague that may destroy Jewish Israel", adding that this "plague" should be dealt with "just as the Health Ministry is dealing with bird flu."

I've got to study Isreal closer. How sad that a nation that arose out of discrimination could have higher ups so comfortable with ignorant condemnation.

"I've got to study Israel closer."

I think Jimmy Carter has some interesting stuff on the Israel Palestinian conflict.

His book "Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid" has some very well informed and honest insight.

Personally I feel that close-minded bigots are much more "destructive to society.". I prefer to 'export' them.

Paul, I think that you may be an anti-Semite.

Like it or not the rise in homosexual behavior outside the closet has greatly contributed to the current moral decay of this nation.GODS punishment upon this nation is obvious. Not just over homosexuality, but other sin as well. What about the majority of people who simply find guys and girls displaying affection in public to be disgusting. Homosexuality needs to be locked back into the closet and not running rampant in public places. I know this is not PC speech it's just the truth.

I suspect you're just trolling, but for the sake of argument, please, AMPATRIOT, draw me a diagram of how homosexuality has lead to moral decay. Mind you, I'm a skeptic, plus I don't believe we're in moral decay. I believe it's more like a moral chrysalis; the old husk is too narrow. Once a shelter, now it needs to be discarded for society to take flight to a higher level of reason. The decay in integrity that you may be noticing is due to the ease with which people take comfort in a sort of shorthand of virtues, a condensed idea of right and wrong that they can naively believe fits all people, all circumstances, all eras. This allows people to smugly believe that there are the righteous [non-gays in this instance who don't do 'that sort of thing' because conveniently enough they aren't made that way] and the sinners [people who trust themselves enough to make highly personalized decisions that harm none but that speak to who they are and how they want to live]. And the 'righteous' shall go live in a mauve fairy castle on a fluffy cloud in the sky with a kindly, but sometimes tyrannical father figure sporting a long beard. The rest shall burn for eternity under the grim ownership of a man the color of a pickled sausage with horns in his head and a forked tail AND scepter. A person couldn't make this shit up - oh, wait a minute, yes, they could. So to my thinking, it is sheep and mob rule that are destructive. While people subscribe to this shorthand of virtues, politicians and the money bags that pay them, can throw up flash cards to the mob, eliciting predictable emotional reactions, controlling them to keep the power in the hands of a greedy few who go to church during election season still smelling, under their aftershave, like the prostitute, male or female, they visited the night before.
Now if you've noticed a decay in manner and ritual, you can blame a society that had forgotten the purposes of good decorum and so the behavior began to seem empty and nonsensical. If you miss good old fashioned manners, I'm with you, but I don't miss convention, the linear perspectives, the doing something a certain way because others do whether or not it is authentic to you. Anyway, having said all this, please, please, please, send along that diagram. Not a spew, mind you, but a detailed map of how my twelve year commitment to my husband has personally dinted the moral integrity of this country. I want details.

It's not caring what people think, Anthony, in the sense that their opinion could impact my own self-esteem as a grown up. It's that this ignorance should be challenged on principle. And changing a few minds now could save a youth who is struggling with their emerging sexuality from the agonies of ignorant comments by family and friends. As a grown up we take ownership for ourselves; when we are kids, people can really cut us, making us feel that who we are intrinsically is bad or harmful. It's easy to take a glib 'fuck them' attitude about hate-mongers, but it doesn't make the world better. Having said that, do I spend hours in bitterness over these people? Not at all - I live a full and happy life. But when their ignorance and ugliness pop up in front of me, I like to think I can step into the ring.

Austin dear, please do not use the "F" word on this intellectual site.

geez you guys are harsh. and misinformed. and i'm talking about you comment folks. Easter has passed and Jesus is risen folks

Romney is an old English name that is a habitational name from a place in Kent, so called from an obscure first element, rumen, + Old English ea 'river' (see Rye). Jorge, I know that you think that everybody is German, but you are confused. George W. Romney was a kinsman of George Romney (1734-1802), a noted portrait painter in Britain during the last quarter of the 18th century

Hey People,

WHy do you think that regular citizens have to accept your perverted ways..? Do you think that humans were originaly designed to be GAY..? A man was designed to be with a woman, and a woman with a man, if not, our speieces would have perished long ago. The gay people would seem to be trying to convert our children with the clubs they force on high school campuses, and the open affection in public, that we have to explain to our children..!
Don't for a second think that we HAVE to accept yoru perverted view of the world. Maybe Isreal has a good idea..?

Bill

Bill Nigh HAS to be a troll. Or else Archie Bunker on crack. I've been watching his comments on other posts here and it has such a predictable thread. No complexity, no contrasts. It's as if he lives his life by a bullet list of James Dobb's, et al views on everything. Here's the list:

Immigrants - ALWAYS Mexicans, they belong in Mexico or dead.
Blacks - Should quit their crying, stop bleeding the system with their crack babies
Gays - Immoral and need to be converted or killed
Women Seeking Abortion - Will live in agonies of self-loathing the rest of their rotten lives AND [quietly assumed] are little whores anyway for even being pregnant.
Jews - Are the cause of all these bad things in some horrible way that has yet to be revealed...Hey, they killed Jesus, right?
Asians - Are running up all of our car insurance costs with their reckless, too-close-driving, cell-phone-talking ways. Plus they eat stray cats, as you'd expect from Pagans.
Democrats - Are either socialists or commies but in any event they are just a bunch of pussies.
War-Protesters - Are a bunch of pussy Democrat [deleted] who probably can't even hold up their signs they've got so much Vaseline built up on their hands. Trouble-making commies.

Oh Bill, your hateful and childish view of the world must be a comfort to you those sleepless nights, trying not to think of the sturdy young men you see wheeling around your friends at the retirement community...

Hey People,

It is strange that if someone does not agree with your view of things they mist be a TROLL..? What gives..? Is the problem with YOU..? You reject the feelings of the majority of the country, and think they THEY are all wrong, and dismiss the fact that YOU might be the ones who are wrong..? I can't imagine having the same views as you, nor trying to limit who is able to post in a free speech society. But i am sure that you WISH you could limit MY free speech..!! Strange, the left is the one who is limiting the rights of the average american...HUH?

BIll

Bill, the laws that come out of opinions like yours limit freedom for gay people like me. Me thinking you are a troll will not lead to a limitation of your freedom. Get real and stop playing that tiresome 'reverse discrimination' card.

Oh Bill, it's just as I said earlier. Your thought process is a predictable bunch of rubbish. That 'slippery slope' argument is weak and senseless. Several decades ago, a white man couldn't have married a black woman. So did changing those laws lead to people marrying children and goats? If you are attracted sexually to goats, Bill, that is another subject all together. We gay people don't share your attraction to children and goats, Bill. I just want to be able to marry the man with whom I have shared a committed, loving and monogamous relationship with for twelve years. Let's stay on subject.

OBAMA barnstormed with Donnie McClurkin, gospel star, pastor to the black elite and crusading homophobe. Barack Obama ripped a page straight from the Bush campaign playbook with his three date barnstorm tour through South Carolina with notorious gay basher, gospel singer Donnie McClurkin. The Grammy winning black gospel singer's last effort on the political scene was his song and shill for Bush's reelection at the Republican National Convention in 2004. Obama has hitched his string to McClurkin's high flying gay bash kite in part out of religious belief (he purports to be somewhat of an evangelical.) Perhaps like this minister who also practices restorative, religious 'therapy' to cure gays who said in defense of McClurkin: "Telling any child that he or she is born gay and cannot change is a death sentence. Gay activists and their blind allies in the mental health, medical and educational professions have blood on their hands for condemning young people to a life mined with such suffering and disease."

Capt's rule of hate:

Never known a homophobe that wasn't dealing with latent issues. All hate is self-loathing.

"If you hate a person, you hate something in him that is part of yourself. What isn't part of ourselves doesn't disturb us."
Hermann Hesse (1877 - 1962)

Don't vote for Obama, he is surrounded by homophobs.