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Abortion Doctor Murder Suspect: The Far-Right Connections
The Kansas City Star's Judy Thomas knows more about the extremist fringes of the anti-abortion movement, and about the radical far right in the Midwest, than just about anyone. By last night, Thomas had already uncovered a wealth of information linking the suspect in the George Tiller murder to these violent netherworlds.
Scott P. Roeder was arrested three hours after Tiller, a well-known abortion provider, was shot to death in the lobby of his church. As Thomas documents, the suspect was labeled a "fanatic" even by some other right-to-lifers, and reportedly supported the idea of "justifiable homicide" to prevent abortions. Roeder paid prison visits to the woman who shot and wounded Tiller in 1993, and wrote a Web post declaring, "Tiller is the concentration camp 'Mengele' of our day and needs to be stopped before he and those who protect him bring judgment upon our nation."
Roeder was also involved in a militia-style anti-government group called the Freemen. Thomas writes:
"Freemen" was a term adopted by those who claimed sovereignty from government jurisdiction and operated under their own legal system, which they called common-law courts. Adherents declared themselves exempt from laws, regulations and taxes and often filed liens against judges, prosecutors and others, claiming that money was owed to them as compensation.
In April 1996, Roeder was arrested in Topeka after Shawnee County sheriff's deputies stopped him for not having a proper license plate. In his car, officers said they found ammunition, a blasting cap, a fuse cord, a one-pound can of gunpowder and two 9-volt batteries, with one connected to a switch that could have been used to trigger a bomb.
Jim Jimerson, supervisor of the Kansas City ATF's bomb and arson unit, worked on the case.
"There wasn't enough there to blow up a building,'' Jimerson said at the time, "but it could make several powerful pipe bombs...There was definitely enough there to kill somebody.''
For this, Roeder was sentenced to two years of supervised probation, and "ordered to dissociate himself from anti-government groups that advocated violence."
There's a lot more damning information in Thomas' piece. After you read the whole thing, take a moment to think about how much time the FBI spent tracking "eco-terrorists" and adding infants, combat veterans, and members of Congress to their million-name terrorist watch list--when they could have been keeping an eye on the likes of Scott Roeder.
Yeah, but babies, pacifists,
Yeah, but babies, pacifists, and members of Congress aren't likely to be armed and dangerous.
Why Is The Left So Impotent?
Why is it so unsurprising the FBI goes after left leaning extremists and more or less ignores those on the right? Even with a liberal President, we can't seem to get Guantanamo closed, as the right wing manages to dominate the media coverage, implying that prisoners will be released onto the streets of Virginia? The President won't release photos of Abu Ghraib, and continues many of the constitutionally suspicious programs of the failed Bush administration. Why? President Truman was tarred for the "loss" of China to communists in 1949 and sat by while McCarthy did so much to ruin so many lives in his anti-communist witch hunts. Why was the left so unable to fight off this manufactured hysteria, hysteria which led to amazingly unAmerican policy choices that saw us toppling democracies and supporting dictators across the globe, with consequences that vividly affect us to this day? We have real, serious problems with consequences that could bring the nation to the brink, and yet we're still arguing over abortion, with fanatics prepared to murder people. Why is the left so impotent when facing the hysteria of the right?
Hysteria of the right
gryphonisle, you ask "Why is the left so impotent when facing the hsteria of the right? Answer: Because we are responsible. We are sane. We are logical. We don't have the weapons to fight against the loonies who don't care who they hurt or kill.
Because much of the left are
Because much of the left are fakers
Why Is The Left So Impotent?
Why is it so unsurprising the FBI goes after left leaning extremists and more or less ignores those on the right? Even with a liberal President, we can't seem to get Guantanamo closed, as the right wing manages to dominate the media coverage, implying that prisoners will be released onto the streets of Virginia? The President won't release photos of Abu Ghraib, and continues many of the constitutionally suspicious programs of the failed Bush administration. Why? President Truman was tarred for the "loss" of China to communists in 1949 and sat by while McCarthy did so much to ruin so many lives in his anti-communist witch hunts. Why was the left so unable to fight off this manufactured hysteria, hysteria which led to amazingly unAmerican policy choices that saw us toppling democracies and supporting dictators across the globe, with consequences that vividly affect us to this day? We have real, serious problems with consequences that could bring the nation to the brink, and yet we're still arguing over abortion, with fanatics prepared to murder people. Why is the left so impotent when facing the hysteria of the right?
Right wing loonatics
Liberals are by nature not killers of innocent people just because they don't agree with us. Those on the far right fringe (and it is a fringe) tend to be deluded with ideas of divine right to eliminate those who stand in the way of their twisted notion of "God's work". Behind Bill O'Rielley's smirk is a tortured mind that sees menace in all who find him reprehensible, a menace to be eliminated at all costs. Just imagine the rush of power he must have felt when he heard that some maniac actually went out and did what he'd been telling Fox listeners needed to be done for months now. He has gone beyond free speech and should be found guilty of inciting murder with his hate speech.
Carrying the weight of our rights on his shoulders.
Give patients & physicians the privacy & right to make decisions regarding late-term abortions. More physicians should be performing the procedure when they deem it necessary & when the patient agrees to it. I am now going to take the time to research why, in this day & age, there are only a handful of physicians that are performing these procedures & bearing the burden of this fight. This subject needs to be less taboo. And NOBODY was safe with this PSYCHOPATHIC man on the streets. My heart goes out to Dr Tiller's family-they should be so proud of him, he was very brave.
Tiller's murder
Part of the Right's hysteria (I am a liberal, but I acknowledge the other side) is simply this: By the time Dr. Tiller got around to his abortions, the fetus was far developed and what he was doing seemed like infanticide.
most dangerous
tagged as:- result
It just goes right back to what I've always said. The right-wing of every culture are the most dangerous. They threaten the peace, prosperity and progress of the innocent. We must never forget, that terrorists are the right-wingers of the arab world. And, the same low-lifes infest our world as well. The NSA should be on top of every one of these nutbags. It is especially true now that there is a black, pro-choice man in the highest office. He must be protected as no other president has before him. The right-wing obviously has a history of violence against our greatest leaders.
The Hatred Dealers
Is there some civilized way to stop the uncivilized hatred mongers from bringing us all down. This is only the beginning, and if we wait until Obama gets shot it will be too late. This is a war, and every progressive has a target on their back. We have been slow to admit that we have been terrorized by our "own", like O'Really, that have demonized real American values for a sleazy and convenient noise that undermines democratic ideals every day. We need a leader who will come out against these dark forces and stare them down. Fox "news" and its gang of power hungry half-wits are breeding hatred and ignorance for their own gains, hiding behind the laws that progressives fight for. Sick iron. So, load em up, boys.....
Trojanrabbit
"Is there some civilized way
"Is there some civilized way to stop the uncivilized hatred mongers from bringing us all down."
Probably not. Normal people insist on applying normal means to stopping selfish and extreme social conservatives, who are in the minority, from walking on their rights. It's in our nature to be tolerant and mostly rational. But, the end of tolerance will be its tolerance of intolerance, unless we of tolerance make exceptions.
In the US, there are two things you don't talk about at the dinner table: politics and religion. And that's our problem. People need to hear what other people think of their views, to their face. We've become so isolated in our little rat holes with televisions that we now have trouble relating to other people just on the basis of their humanity, their personhood, standing there and breathing in front of us.
Uncivilized hate mongers
It has ceased to amuse me how people who cant about tolerance only mean tolerance of their pet hobby horses, and who are in favour of people having to hear what they think but begin to shout when it's time to return the favour. The labels of selfish and extreme can be applied to both ends of the liberal-conservative spectrum.
Having just read some of the rather chilling 'Kansas Abortion Stories' I for one agree that there are times when tolerance ceases to be appropriate. Such as when someone decides to kill an innocent baby just as it is ready to be born, to avoid having to care for a child with physical defects. They, with their defects of character and courage, which offend me far more greatly, still get to walk around, and wonder why they feel wounded. For heavens sake if you cannot provide unconditional love even in theory, please get sterilized, you do not have what it takes to parent even a physically 'perfect' child. Parenting is a spiritual journey that will unmake and remake you and takes everything you have and more. And even your 'perfect' child can be disabled in an accident. What happens then? Do they get the needle because they're no good to you any more? To say nothing of the survivor guilt suffered by the siblings who were acceptable enough to be allowed to survive. Some kind of 'love' - love is as love does, I say.
Wouldn't it be better to give the babies the care they need for as long as they need it, to relate to them 'just on the basis of their humanity, their personhood, standing there and breathing in front of us'?
there is no such thing as an
there is no such thing as an "abortion doc". Dr. Tiller was an obstetrician/gynecologist with a varied practice who performed abortions as part of reproductive health care. your words are innaccurate and redolant of the laziness of most of the journalism on this subject. the anti-choice movement, for example, is not pro-life. the pro-choice movement is not pro-abortion.
America is under attack by domestic terrorists
I watched a segment of the Rachel Maddow Show last night where she interviewed Jonathan Turley, a Constitutional scholar and legal expert whose views I admire highly. In the interview, Turley suggested that incidents like this are unpreventable in a democracy where hate speech, even saying that an entire group of people should be exterminated, is protected unless it can be shown that the speech could cause an immanent outbreak of violence. (As I understand it, sort of the equivalent of yelling "lynch him" when you are a member of a mob).
I respectfully disagree with Turley on this assertion. I believe that since the shooter had previous weapons convictions he should have never been able to own a gun again. This goes back to the issue of gun control, where we have failed as a society to protect ourselves from those who want and can afford guns and the ammunition it takes to learn to shoot them well. In other words, the right wingnuts.
Until the Reagan Administration, mass media was required to provide equal time for any person they attacked by name. This was called the "Fairness Doctrine", and by dismantling the Fairness Doctrine the door was opened for a 24/7 attack machine on radio and TV for anyone with the $$ to do it. Along with consolidating media into the hands of a few (such as Clear Channel and Rupert Murdoch) we are living the results.
Obama has pooh-poohed the Fairness Doctrine. He also seems to be coming down on the wrong side of several Constitutional and legal issues from the last administration. When will Progressives from all political sides get a fair shake from the election process? Obama ran on "change". WTF kind of change are we getting? It's not a change in transparency, it's not a change in government accountability, it's not a change in justice. It's the same old shit.
Getting back to the shooter; he is associated with groups that advocate violence against public and private citizens. If this is not domestic terrorism, I would like to know by what definition it is excluded. Why do we tolerate groups like this who have a proven record of murder? Why do we tolerate "news" organizations who accuse people of murder for days on end and have no consequences? This is the most specious op-ed practice that incites people to commit violent crimes. I cannot see how a free society can permit unchallenged hate speech based on your ability to afford it.
-Wexler
______________________________________________________________
If I would have known I was going to live this long, I would have taken better care of myself.
~~~ George Burns
Those who support the
tagged as:- solution
Those who support the terroristic killer of the doctor are as insane as the individual who commited the crime. They are no different than the people who support a terrorists bomber killling people. This idea that the means justifies the end seems to be the call of all regligous radicals. They seem to think only their ideas are the "way". Their minds are sick and warped. You may call yourself a Christian or Muslin but you have terrible mental problems. The sooner society rids itself of these individuals or reeducates them, the better off it will be. I doubt when an individual reaches this level of insanity that they can be reeducated.
Those who support the
tagged as:- solution
Those who support the terroristic killer of the doctor are as insane as the individual who commited the crime. They are no different than the people who support a terrorists bomber killling people. This idea that the means justifies the end seems to be the call of all regligous radicals. They seem to think only their ideas are the "way". Their minds are sick and warped. You may call yourself a Christian or Muslin but you have terrible mental problems. The sooner society rids itself of these individuals or reeducates them, the better off it will be. I doubt when an individual reaches this level of insanity that they can be reeducated.
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