Season Six, Episode 6: "Sundown" (March 2)
Creepy. That's probably be the best word to describe last night's bloody, game changing episode, which forever changed the way we'll listen to a popular children's song. What bargain did Flocke (faux Locke) make with Sayid? Is Dogen really gone forever? And for the love of god, will Sun and Jin ever reunite?
To help four MoJo staffers dissect it all, we invited Mac Slocum from the popular Filmfodder blog to join in. Thanks, Mac! Read the chat below, and tune in for more guest bloggers in the coming weeks.
Jen Phillips, Assistant Editor: Hey everyone.
Laurin Asdal, Director of Development: Howdy.
Nikki Gloudeman, New Media Fellow: Mac, thanks so much for joining us!
Mac Slocum, Lost blogger: You bet! Thanks for having me.
Nikki: So last night's episode...wow, yeah? I'd say creepiest in the history of the show.
Mac: Uh, yeah. It got dark in those closing moments.
Samantha Schaberg, Administrative Assistant: I loved the music.
Nikki: Freakiest version of that children's song. Gave me chills. Also: No more temple, hooray!
Mac: Yeah, thank God for that. The Epcot Temple needed to go.
Nikki: Yes it was pretty lame. Now it's fight time in the jungle. Much more interesting.
Laurin: Bring it back to the beginning.
Ben Buchwalter, Editorial Fellow: It's gonna. be. crazy.
Nikki: Anyone surprised by Sayid going bad?
Samantha: I wasn't surprised that out of all of them, a dark force would choose Sayid to take over. With his background it would seem easiest.
Nikki: He's always struggled with being a good man or a bad man, and apparently he ultimately couldn't get past his past.
Ben: Major pushover.
Mac: Ha! Yes, Sayid = demonic pushover. That's fantastic.
Nikki: He's also always put in shitty situations, where he feels he has to murder to do the right thing.
Mac: Right, that was something I noticed in the alt timeline. Unlike Alt Locke or Alt Jack, Alt Sayid didn't find redemption.
Jen: Well, kind of. In his flash sideways life he was able to use his powers for good...sort of.
Mac: Saving the world from Keamy's eggs.
Nikki: But he's still a murderer. He said he wasn't like that anymore...but he was. So the island and alt lives are definitely mirroring each other.
Ben: But it seems like we'll see more about Sayid from the alt timeline...he just met Jin so they've got to build that up.
Nikki: Yes, he could find redemption there.
Jen: Yeah, I"m betting next week is Jin and Sun's episode.
Ben: Sounds romantic.
Mac: It's about time, right? Although, I wonder where Jin is.
Nikki: Speaking of eggs, apparently they symbolize souls in many ancient religions, just throwing that out there. Keamy=frying up Sayid's soul?
Jen: Is it weird I find Keamy kind of attractive? He can make me eggs.
Nikki: So, some interesting things in the now thankfully gone temple. Notably, Dogen's speech about the scale and being recruited by Jacob.
Mac: Yes, that was important. No idea if it's true though.
Samantha: Yeah I was fascinated by that. Dogen made Jacob sound not so nice making him leave his son.
Jen: It's almost like Dogen thinks Jacob was cheating.
Mac: I've seen this discussed elsewhere— but Sayid did leave Dogen and Lennon floating in the Resurrection Jacuzzi.
Ben: Resurrection Jacuzzi: great band name.
Jen: Yes, so they could come back. And if they did, they would be bad?
Mac: And last week, Hurley ran into Jacob as he seemed to be looking at the Jacuzzi water. No idea if that's relevant.
Nikki: Lots of people come back from dead on this show, so wouldn't be surprised. Kind of interesting that Dogen said Sayid's soul fell to the "wrong side" rather than "evil side." Still possible were not seeing pure good and evil at play.
Mac: Makes me think that we're not dealing with pure good (Jacob) or pure evil (Flocke). They're both pretty screwy with mixed-up intentions. How about that deal Dogen had to make to save his son?
Jen: Crappy deal. Though he shouldn't have drove drunk. Frankly, I think Jacob may turn out to be the more destructive force.
Nikki: Yes, that was interesting. It seems the bargain is that the person you love lives, but you don't get them. This was the bargain made by Jacob to Dogen and MIB to Sayid with Nadia?
Laurin: Well I sort of look at it like this. Jacob offers him to save his son but at the expense of his own misery, aka a selfless act. MIB offers Sayid anything he wants but it's more like a deal with the devil.
Jen: Both are manipulating island people for their own purposes.
Jen: Promo said there would be answers, but I feel like there weren't that many.
Mac: Ah, yes, the "answers."
Nikki: ABC promo department always says that.
Samantha: And we always watch.
Laurin: There were definitely very few answers and now I have more questions.
Ben: I saw answers in the form of TV ads.
Mac: I'm sure that drives the Lost producers nuts. I seem to remember in a past podcast that they have no say over that marketing stuff. It was really bad back in season 3 when they did a promo about "answers" leading up to that god-awful episode about Jack's tattoos.
Nikki: Honestly, though, I'm ok with not having answers. They need to make it intriguing to keep watching. We've got 12 hours left, and the last 5 or so should steamroll through answers and be a wild ride.
Mac: The thing that's interesting is that there have been answers. They just come within the storyline— not in big expository moments. Example: we now know a heck of a lot more about Smokey than we did in year's past.
Laurin: Let's talk about ol' crazy eyed (and crazy weave) Claire. Now she knows Kate has Aaron but it didn't seem to faze her. Is she just bat shit, or…?
Mac: Poor poor Claire.
Jen: I mean, b*tch is CRAZY..
Mac: Such a sweet girl.
Nikki: I loved Miles' line: "She's still hot though."
Mac: So here's the thing though—do you think she actually died? I always thought that's what happened—that she died during the mercenary attack.
Laurin: Me too.
Mac: She was never the same after that.
Jen: So if you die on island and come back, you're bad? Is that a law?
Laurin: That's an interesting theory.
Nikki: So it's not her but a spirit in possession of her body, a la Flocke?
Mac: No idea. I'm also not sure why Flocke can no longer take on other human forms.
Ben: No longer take on forms? What other human forms has he taken on?
Mac: Right. He (supposedly) was Christian Shephard and Yemi (Eko's brother).
Nikki: Oh yeah, Yemi. And all the other ghosts that returned (like Walt).
Mac: But that hasn't been confirmed. Total conjecture on my part.
Ben: Seems like a pretty solid theory.
Mac: Thanks. I'll stick to it until I'm proven to be unbelievably wrong.
Jen: BTW, Mac, Where is Walt? Will we see him again?
Mac: I doubt it. He's like 30 now, right?
Nikki: So I know there was discussion about Desmond being the dude "coming" to the island. But another interesting theory is Widmore.
Ben: I miss Desy.
Nikki: Me too, brotha.
Jen: I hope it's Desmond. I've officially given up on Walt.
Mac: Yeah, I imagine we'll see some sort of Desmond, Widmore, Mrs. Hawking group.
Laurin: Is it possible they are the one who will fight against Flocke?
Jen: Could be, as they're all for "fate." Aka Jacob.
Mac: Maybe ...perhaps Ben and Widmore will become unlikely allies in a battle against Flocke?
Ben: Super redemption potential for Ben.
Mac: BTW—how about the brief scene between Ben and Sayid last night?
Mac: Man, Ben got creeped out.
Laurin: I know! To have ben creeped out creeped me out hard.
Ben: Looked like he had seen that before.
Mac: And that's just so amazing. You know? Think about when Sayid was torturing him in the hatch armory. And now that? What a trajectory.
Jen: I believe in Ben. Of everyone, he loves the island the most I think.
Mac: So, the teams: Flock has Claire, Sayid and that random group of Others. And then there's Jack and Hurley.
Mac: Kate, Miles, Ilana, Lapidus, Ben.
Jen: Kate and Claire catfight!!!!
Ben: That's the digg headline.
Mac: Sawyer is supposedly with Flocke, but he was noticeably absent last night. And Jin.
Nikki: Kate could go either way.
Jen: That's what she said.
Mac: Jin just wants to go home dammit.
Nikki: It's sort of like when they drew battle lines in season 4. Again, some going with Locke, and some going with Jack.
Jen: Right, two tribes. Was Sawyer a toss-up the last time Jack and Locke split up?
Mac: Yeah I think so. He's always a toss-up. Not a big Joiner, that one.
Nikki: This show is all about repeating things in different seasons.
Jen: I wonder if Jacob is priming Jack to be a leader again, gather in all the little Lost sheepies.
Mac: So what's the deal with the ash?
Jen: Seems to come from Jacob's fireplace and keep Smokey out.
Mac: Well, Smokey was able to get into the temple after Dogen was killed. And I'm sure there was still plenty of ash sprinkled around. They were going to town with that stuff over the last couple episodes.
Jen: Right, the rules seem to have changed.
Mac: So it would seem the ash only works if the temple leader is alive?
Jen: Or there's a loophole.
Mac: Yeah, that's a good point. Kill the leader and you can get around the ash—maybe there's no direct connection. Could be an either or.
Nikki: I was reading that Ben might be the loophole somehow. Since he's always used by people for the purpose of the island.
Jen: Kind of a cipher, sure.
Ben: I think Widmore is in the Flocke camp and he and Ben are fighting as satellites for Jacob and Flocke.
Mac: Now that's interesting.
Jen: Like "seconds" in a duel. Cool idea.
Mac: Crap, I forgot Richard. He's obviously anti-Flocke.
Ben: And Ben was in charge in the reign of Jacob and now Widmore is the guy coming back to the island.
Nikki: So they're being used as pawns by larger forces? I wonder if MIB and Jacob are themselves pawns, and we still haven't seen the true original force.
Mac: Right. I mean, there's a set of rules. Someone had to make those up. Can't kill Jacob directly. Can't kill the candidates. Can't take on other human forms. That's a lot of "can'ts."
Jen: Maybe God is a lawyer.
Mac: I bet it's Cindy.
Nikki: Or Walt's dog.
Mac: Yes, Vincent is the key!
Jen: I have a sneaking feeling you're right, there's some super huge figure we haven't even met yet.
Ben: I bet we've met him/her but, we just don't know he or she is super huge.
Nikki: Ok, one other question: do you think the alt timeline is what's going to be what's promised to the castaways after the show is finished?
Mac: I'm not sure what I think of the alt timeline yet. I'm not sure if it's pure fabrication, or someone's wish, or the end of a "deal."
Nikki: I'm really enjoying it, because it gives the show a weird sense of normalcy and an emotional core. But I can't figure it out.
Mac: They're taking it much further than I thought. I initially thought it would just be the "Oceanic castaways if they didn't crash." But it's much more than that. And I'm thinking—and this could again be wrong— that the lynchpin is this question: What would have happened to the castaways if Jacob hadn't intervened?
Nikki: Ok, should probably wrap up, fave scene of last night?
Mac: Last scene—Evil Sayid walking through the carnarge. Man, chills.
Nikki: Yep, mine too, with the song playing in the background. It actually wasn't my fave ep, but that scene was incredible. And unexpected.
Mac: Yeah, jaw dropper.
Jen: Claire singing and cradling an imaginary baby in the bottom of the pit. Creeeepy!
Mac: Squirrel baby!
Jen: Possum baby!
Mac: That's got to be in the gift shop, right?
Jen: Ben, your fave scene?
Ben: I think that last scene just because it was different.
Nikki: I also liked Sayid talking to Nadia about being unworthy. Lovely acting, very touching.
Ben: I don't typically like Sayid episodes. He's by far my least favorite character.
Nikki: Wha??? But he's the original bad ass! He detonates hydrogen bombs! And kicks ass!
Ben: I think he's much more interesting now that he's evil.
Mac: I know what you mean, Ben. They can get a little angsty.
Ben: And he's changed the least out of all the characters.
Jen: Too bad they couldn't find a middle-eastern actor to play Sayid.
Mac: The fight between Sayid and Dogen was pretty slick. Biggest fight scene Lost has ever had.
Jen: Yes, and sharp. Shades of Kill Bill.
Nikki: Alright guys, thanks for the chat!
Jen: Sorry I said I found Keamy attractive. I must be possessed by the darkness. Ciao, everybody!
Ben: Thanks for visiting, Mac!
Mac: Thanks for this! Really enjoyed it.