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Mormon Church GOTV for Prop 8: "Do All You Can"
Another night in Oakland, another round of Prop 8 picketing. This time a couple dozen people spread out on each of the four corners at MacArthur and High Sts. in east Oakland, California leading the fight against gay marriage. The scene was, oddly enough, jumping. Lots of teenagers, some grandmas, cheering, each with a sign. The most popular were "Prop 8 = Free Speech" (that 'equal' is making it into the anti-gay marriage push holds its own irony), and "Honk if you Support Prop 8" (the intersection was as loud as a a Manhattan thoroughfare). Detractors, those with No on Prop 8 signs and vocal drivers provoked screaming ("God created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve!"), middle fingers out of car windows, lots of pointing against windshields, a real show of humanity.
I talked to a few picketers and found out they're all from area Mormon churches. They've been picketing every night at various spots across the Bay Area. One young woman, Patricia, who's 18, said she and her church go to a different intersection most every night. I asked if she was going to vote. "Yeah, I'm voting, yes on Prop 8." Who are you voting for for president? Her response might be what surprised me the most, after the jump.
"I'm not," she said. "I'm only voting for Prop 8, nothing else, that's the only thing that's important." Seriously? She said it's so important because without it "there will be gay marriage in my church."
While it's safe to say that the Mormon Church isn't going to start blessing same-sex unions in their temples, the message she's sending is a strategic one. The Church of Latter Day Saints has all but ordered its congregants to campaign for, and donate to (the church has raised at least $10 million from its members), Prop 8's passage. From High Country News:
In June, the church's top prophets commanded Mormons "to do all you can" to work for Proposition 8 and donate money to the campaign. Mormon leaders throughout California read the instructions to their congregations, which have more than 750,000 members. Word spread everywhere in the Mormon realm. In August, the prophets added pages of elaboration: "The Church has a single, undeviating standard of sexual morality: intimate relations are proper only between a husband and a wife united in bonds of matrimony. ... Any dilution of the traditional definition of marriage will further erode the already weakened stability of marriages and family generally...with harmful consequences for society."
At least in Oakland its congregants are out in force, and there's no sign they're slowing down. "We've seen a bunch of haters," said Patricia, "but also a lot of supporters."
UPDATE: Kevin Drum looks at the latest Prop 8 poll numbers out today. "It's gonna be close, folks."
13] Jesus loved the sinner even while decrying the sin, as evidenced in the case of the woman taken in adultery: treating her kindly, but exhorting her to "sin no more." [14] Tolerance as a gospel principle means love and forgiveness of one another, not "tolerating" transgression.
In today's secular world, the idea of tolerance has come to mean something entirely different. Instead of love, it has come to mean condone ? acceptance of wrongful behavior as the price of friendship. Jesus taught that we love and care for one another without condoning transgression. But today's politically palatable definition insists that unless one accepts the sin he does not tolerate the sinner.
As Elder Dallin H. Oaks has explained,"Tolerance obviously requires a non-contentious manner of relating toward one another's differences. But tolerance does not require abandoning one's standards or one's opinions on political or public policy choices. Tolerance is a way of reacting to diversity, not a command to insulate it from examination." [15]
On June 20, 2008, the First Presidency of the Church distributed a letter about "Preserving Traditional Marriage and Strengthening Families," This small segment talkes about you many have been speaking of concerning "Judging". You can read the entire letter at http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/commentary/the-divine-institutio...
13] Jesus loved the sinner even while decrying the sin, as evidenced in the case of the woman taken in adultery: treating her kindly, but exhorting her to "sin no more." [14] Tolerance as a gospel principle means love and forgiveness of one another, not "tolerating" transgression.
In today's secular world, the idea of tolerance has come to mean something entirely different. Instead of love, it has come to mean condone ? acceptance of wrongful behavior as the price of friendship. Jesus taught that we love and care for one another without condoning transgression. But today's politically palatable definition insists that unless one accepts the sin he does not tolerate the sinner.
As Elder Dallin H. Oaks has explained,"Tolerance obviously requires a non-contentious manner of relating toward one another's differences. But tolerance does not require abandoning one's standards or one's opinions on political or public policy choices. Tolerance is a way of reacting to diversity, not a command to insulate it from examination." [15]
On June 20, 2008, the First Presidency of the Church distributed a letter about "Preserving Traditional Marriage and Strengthening Families," This small segment talkes about you many have been speaking of concerning "Judging". You can read the entire letter at http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/commentary/the-divine-institutio...
Keep these images in mind...Mitt Romney will be back as some incarnation of a presidential candidate in 4 years if not sooner.
I don't know why folks want to deny the suffering the rest of us enjoy to the homos.
"I'm not," she said. "I'm only voting for Prop 8, nothing else, that's the only thing that's important." Seriously? She said it's so important because without it "there will be gay marriage in my church."
Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, but are churches covered by anti-discrimination laws? I mean, I always imagined that if I took my Jewish bride to a Catholic Church to be married, the priest would tell us to bugger off. Would the legalization of gay marriage cause churches to be forced to perform such ceremonies or would they be left to people who aren't bigots?
Assuming that churches still get a say in who they marry, do you think it was an intentional distortion that made this girl think that the Secret Service was going to storm her church and force her priest to perform a gay marriage?
In Canada, where I live, gay marriage is legal... but no church is "forced" to perform gay marriage.
Can we tax churches now?
As Chris Hitchens wrote, "Religion poisons everything". Not only the anti-gay issue, but what a set of single issue morons that the church has produced.
Seems this single issue is more popular to rally the religious far right than abortion this year, at least in California.
What's interesting is the single issue has always been used to push the lemmings into voting for the preseidential candidate that claims to support the religious right's position on the single issue, whereas the lady interviewed above has a total disconnect. I'm curious if she represents the thinking of the majority of the Mormon protestors, or if she is a 'maverick' (you betcha).
Does the Book of Mormon specifically say to persecute gays? Christ taught love and forgiveness - not persecution. Christianity, at least the way I practise it, does not include judging other people. In the words of Christ, "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do."
Gary,
Or perhaps more on point, Christ instructed his followers, "Judge not, or you will be judged."
The mormons are defending traditional marriage? That's rich. Didn't they break apart from other religions to practice polygamy for men only? Shouldn't it be marriage is only between a man and his wives?
I can't really contribute anything to what's been said here.
I can only shake my head at the lack of awareness.
Mormons picketing to defend traditional marriage? What is our culture coming to?
Where would they be if the State of California decided to permit polygamy?
How is this legal? Is it not illegal for a church to take an active role in supporting a political cause? Who is going to test this? ACLU?
I'm not so much pro-gay or anti-gay(I think either view is retarded, frankly) as I am pro-liberty, as in, 'you're a US citizen, if you choose to live a traditional lifestyle, or not, then that's up to you, and neither the 'government' nor some group of frothy-mouthed Jesusbiblers have any real right to tell you otherwise. Either we mean the 'freedom' part or we don't, and furthermore, this is a religious group that has now entered the political sphere, are they still tax-exempt? If so, someone needs to get on the phone to the IRS and get that 'business' changed. I'm against high-dollar so-called 'mainstream' religion as it is. I hold that many such institutions and groups have less-than-squeaky-clean morals and practices, and are quite interested in asserting their presumed moral and political powers over the lives of others. Evangelists who like to go on crusades unfortunately start walking down the same general path as Adolf Hitler, I mean, how far are you from sewing a pink star on someone's shirt after you've singled them out and told them they can't be married? Alas, discrimination and prejudice are alive and well in the USA today, and it's a fact of life.
All of that having been said, let's examine the issue of marriage to anyone just a little bit closer, in terms of favorable status on income taxes and in the eyes of the law and so forth. What benefit is there, exactly, in being married? Free government doughnuts? Probably. And, people aren't above attempting to exploit a given arrangement for financial reasons, and CA is LEGENDARY in terms of its' 'alternative lifestyles' and is viewed by many as a crucible of moral decline, not to mention that they can't seem to get their state budget balanced, oh the problems of CA are worthy of a multi-volume saga full of pithy words and sad tales of dreams and hopes gone awry, as well as unionized actors and writers slaving away in Hollywood propaganda factories, selling the 'dream' to millions. Heck, it's a series. A series of errors, by my reckoning, I've only been to CA a few times, but feel no direct compulsion to ever go there again, if it's not the sales tax, it's the apparent confusion on the immigration issue, or the living in an earthquake zone stuff, or the government union stuff, marriage may traditionally be a union between a man and a woman for the purpose of starting a family, but in that state, the screwing around that goes on is legendary, and the taxpayer gets rammed from behind pretty much on a daily basis.
I'm less worried about the fate of gay marriage in CA than I am concerned with how they're ever going to take issue with the public corruption. Nuff said.
Absolutely it was a distortion of the truth that made that girl believe gay marriages will happen in her church. Obviously she doesn't know how to think with her own head either because Mormons don't allow anybody they consider "unworthy" to enter the temple for marriage and I'm certain a same-sex couple would fall under that banner.
The law, as it is now in California, says that same-sex couples can marry under the state, but that churches still have the right to turn away same-sex couples if it goes against their beliefs. All of the Yes on Prop. 8 stuff is completely misleading and fear-mongering in order to mobilize their fanatical base.
All this effort and expense to take away gay rights could be spent helping the homeless, the mentally unhealthy and young mothers who have swallowed the cool-aid about abortion and now are raising a child in a world that often doesn't care much about what happens after birth. Shame on the churches for redirecting energy and funds that would help people in need to instead massage their childhood phobia of gay people.
Thank GOD for the Mormon Church defending our family aginst the on slaught of you people.
You can NOT force society to accept the deviant way you CHOOSE to live. Stop trying to force everyone else to think what you do is NORMAL..
You can get married anytime you want, just not to your girlfriend or boyfriend.
And how come if you want us to let you marry your same sex, how come we can't marry a goat.? or your 12 yr old niece, or 10 women..?
Bill
Bill Nigh...
I certainly hope you are being sarcastic, because if you aren't, you've illustrated yourself to be ignorant, bigoted, and flat out stupid.
I truly hope that your comment is a joke. I pity you if it was not. It must be sad to live such an unenlightened life.
Perhaps if you pull the Bible out of your ass, you could concentrate on spelling things correctly, or perhaps on spontaneously combusting (which would do the world a favor).
Enlightened..? Is that what you call forcing people to accept what is MORALLY wrong and deviant..?
I, nor anyone else, care what you do behind your deviant doors, but keep it in the closet and stop trying to FORCE everyone to accept what is MORALLY wrong..!!!
Enlightened does not only mean what YOU think it means. It usually has a spiritual connotation, and if you think that spiritual enlightenment involves deviant sex practices, you are very wrong.
Bill
LOL
WOW Bill, how very important you must be.
I think I must be speaking to God, not to Bill... since you are obviously the expert on what is morally right and wrong.
So, when you say "deviant sex practices," are you suggesting that Mormon men who screw teenagers is morally correct? Is THAT something that is OK for you? Or how about 65 year old men marrying several teenage girls and basically raping them? And forcing them to have children?
But I must be mistaken, you are obviously the expert on right and wrong.
[deleted]
When I read Bill's post, I thought he's joking, then I realized he was serious. Bill, you poor, poor, pathetic man. I feel sorry for you.
Why this issue? Out of all of the issues we face, why is this sooo important to them? Why not put all of this effort into ending homelessness, child abuse, or somthing life saving like ending the genoside in Darfur or providing 10 million dollars to feed live people that are starving in this country? That would seem to be the more "Christian" thing to do. If two grown people want to enter into a contract that binds them to each other, what business is it of anyone but those two people?
Oh Bill, I'm for allowing people to choose to commit to their soul mates, and what business is it of yours anyway? The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints isn't going to be forced to do anything they don't choose to, but the Church IS asking that they have the right to force other, non-members, to live their lives in a manner acceptable to the Church.
Remember that oh-so-insignificant document, the Declaration of Independence, that states that ALL men have certain inalienable rights, among them being the right to life, liberty, AND HAPPINESS? Or does that only apply to SOME people?
So, if Prop loses, will the LDS church excommunicate every Mormon in California? That would bve a thing to see. They'd have to start a whole new church.
First of all, lets get this out of the way. I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints. To some of you that are uninformed, there was a short period of time when the Church practiced Polygamy. This was officially ended about 1890, when most of the practice was over. Now, aside from theBook of Mormon, the Bible also calls same sex an abomination.
Now lets look
I don't know what happened, but I had not finished. Lets look at the practicality. The basis of Human society living together is the family unit. First we lived as families, then families into groups, then groups into small cities etc. Without satisfactory group living youhave no freedom, no peace, no safety,
no food, or transportation. You have only anarchey. the rule of the bigest, the strongest, the one that can whip everyone else. Families give us civilization, and love of each other. Thank you With Love and Prayers Bill
All religions teach sexual restraint: to be concerned with things of the spirit rather than the flesh.
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami writes in The Path of Perfection:
"Yoga does not mean going to some class, paying some money, engaging in gymnastics, and then returning home to drink, smoke, and engage in sex. Such yoga is practiced by societies of the cheaters and the cheated...If one tells you that you can indulge in sex as much as you like and at the same time become a yogi, he is cheating you. If some so-called guru tells you to give him money in exchange for some mantra and that you can go on and engage in all kinds of nonsense, he is just cheating you. Because we want something sublime and yet want it cheaply, we put ourselves in a position to be cheated...if we want perfection in yoga, we have to pay for it by abstaining from sex. Perfection in yoga is not something childish, and Bhagavad-gita instructs us that if we try to make yoga into something childish, we will be cheated. There are many cheaters awaiting us, waiting to take our money, giving us nothing, and then leaving."
With regard to Christians, the apostle Paul taught his followers to bless their persecutors and not curse them (Romans 12:14), to care for their enemies by providing them with food and drink (12:20), and to pay their taxes and obey all earthly governments (13:1-7). He mentioned giving all his belongings to feed the hungry (I Corinthians 13:3), and taught giving to the person in need (Ephesians 4:23). He told his followers it was wrong to take their conflicts before non-Christian courts rather than before the saints. (I Corinthians 6:1)
Paul taught that "it is good for a man not to touch a woman," i.e., it is best to be celibate, but because of prevailing immoralities, marriage is acceptable. Divorce is permissible in the case of an unbeliever demanding separation. (I Corinthians 7)
Paul repeatedly attacked sexual immorality:
"This is God's will--your sanctification, that you keep yourselves from sexual immorality, that each of you learn how to take his own wife in purity and honor, not in lustful passion like the gentiles who have no knowledge of God." (I Thessalonians 4:3-5)
Paul told his followers not to associate with sexually immoral people (I Corinthians 5:9-12, 6:15,18). He condemned homosexuality (Romans 1:24-27) and incest (I Corinthians 5:1).
"Make no mistake," warned Paul, "no fornicator or idolater, none who are guilty either of adultery or of homosexual perversion, no thieves or grabbers or drunkards or slanderers or swindlers, will possess the kingdom of God." (I Corinthians 6:9-10 [NEB])
Paul condemned wickedness, immorality, depravity, greed, envy, murder, quarreling, deceit, malignity, gossip, slander, insolence, pride (Romans 1:29-30), drunkenness, carousing, debauchery, jealousy (Romans 13:13), sensuality, magic arts, animosities, bad temper, selfishness, dissensions, envy (Galatians 5:19-21; greediness (Ephesians 4:19; Colossians 3:5), foul speech, anger, clamor, abusive language, malice (Ephesians 4:29-32), dishonesty (Colossians 3:13), materialism (I Timothy 6:6-11), conceit, avarice, boasting and treachery. (II Timothy 3:2-4)
Paul told the gentiles to train themselves for godliness, to practice self-control and lead upright, godly lives (Galatians 5:23; I Timothy 4:7; II Timothy 1:7; Titus 2:11-12). He instructed them to ALWAYS pray constantly. (I Thessalonians 5:17)
Paul praised love, joy, peace, kindness, generosity, fidelity and gentleness (Galatians 5:22-23). He told his followers to conduct themselves with humility and gentleness (Ephesians 4:2), to speak to one another in psalms and hymns; to sing heartily and make music to the Lord. (Ephesians 5:19; Colossians 3:16)
Paul wrote further that women should cover their heads while worshiping, and that long hair on males is dishonorable. (I Corinthians 11:5-14) According to Paul, Christian women are to dress modestly and prudently, and are not to be adorned with braided hair, gold or pearls or expensive clothes. (I Timothy 2:9)
A couple of years ago, Church & State, the periodical put out by Americans United for Separation of Church and State quoted a conservative Christian as having admitted that once "God's design" is removed from the argument, there's no real reason to limit marriage to one man and one woman.
Conservatives do have a point, however, when they argue that if we legalize same-sex marriages, what's to stop us from legalizing incest or polygamy?
Regarding same-sex marriages: back in 1995, when I was traveling with a group of activists, protesting the Republicans "Contract On America," I said that although I couldn't support same-sex marriages, I had no problem with civil unions. This is Jimmy Carter's position today.
A few years ago, my friend Dave Browning, a conservative, pro-life Republican in San Diego, said he opposed same-sex marriages on the grounds that the definition of marriage (an institution that has lasted thousands of years) should not be changed. When I asked him about civil unions, however, he couldn't raise any objections!
Also a few years ago, I told my friend Greg, who is gay, that I don't even have any opposition to same-sex marriages, as long as churches and other religious institutions aren't forced to recognize them. In one of his broadcasts from a few years ago, Sean Hannity warned viewers about a future in which churches that refuse to recognize same-sex marriages lose their tax-exempt status. Greg dismissed Sean Hannity's words as right-wing propaganda.
Vote No on Prop 8.
//"All religions teach sexual restraint: to be concerned with things of the spirit rather than the flesh."\\
Um not not ALL religions do this.
Unitarian's do not teach this and Methodists are all for Gay Marriages.
I really wish there was a Prop MYOB bill. I'm not gay but I have been following enough scientific research that supports the fact that these people are a victim of their physiological makeup and that the problem most likely began right en utero. First blacks, now gays, one would think that the mormons who themselves are discriminated against in many quarters as a cult, would know what it is like to be at the receiving end.
Check out this amazing site - it will make your day.
http://www.justgiving.com/atheistbus?page=1#donationtable
Like W. H. Bill Higgins above, I'm a member of the LDS church, aka the Mormons. He forgot to mention that polygamy didn't entirely disappear, it just went underground. Some polygamist Mormons even fled to Mexico. Mitt Romney could tell you about that, since some of them were his relatives.
I've been sitting though months of church leaders telling us to do all we can to get Prop 8 approved. And I'm surprised at 2 things -- 1) that it's legal to do so, because it should not be, and 2) that my church is throwing so much energy into being on the wrong side of history again.
I personally despise 8 and plan on voting against it, as do most of the Mormons I would call friends. And like many of them, my wife and I have wondered if we should continue to be involved with a church that pursues such undemocratic and theologically wrong goals.
At any rate, our tithing dollars now go to No on 8 rather than the church. One small step, as they say.
To be continued...
Ask the Mormon Church how many of their "members" committed suicide due to their hatred of gays??
I was born mormon...married mormon...had 2 kids...then had to divorce the mormon man I married who won't admit he is gay.
He was so frustrated with his own sexuality and the oppression that was born and bred into his own consciousness that he took his aggravation out on me in the form of physical violence. Unintended consequence of institutionalizing hatred of gayness.
Tenuous ties keep me connected to the LDS community now, only because my family is all-or-nothing mormon and I don't want to loose their love, however conditional it may be. Mormon thought is archaic and bigoted and misogynistic, I cannot support a church that promotes such vitriol (I pay no tithes or offerings to the church, donating my funds to other causes). However, I can still associate with the people of the church who are just as embarrassed as I am over the intolerance and fear-mongering. If I, and others like me, left the church entirely, who would be left to act as a voice of reason? I hear the mormon party line from friends and family and I object in a way that subverts and gets them thinking instead of towing the party line blindly. Some like me for my different voice, but most don't as they are taught to fear anything that threatens their homogeneity.
It is a tough lifestyle to be born into, and even tougher to leave, no matter how much you don't believe. Family is important and so I choose to be marginally associated with the church so that my kool-aid drinking family won't ostracize me and my kids. It is a tough choice to make.
I've found personally and through observation, religion, at its core, is about CONTROL, through shame, fear and guilt. PERIOD.
case in point.... in the LDS temple in Seattle, WA, 1996, after the Mormons take all their vows (i.e. to obey their husbands as their husbands obey God - even if you don't have one! - to commit EVERYTHING you have and are to the building up of the kingdom of God on earth / etc.), a film is shown about God's messengers appearing to Adam...Adam essentially saying, well, if it wasn't for the WOMAN, I wouldn't have partaken of the apple - FARCE! -...ANYway, at the end of the film, no kidding, there are loud clapping thunderstorm and lightening bolts with Satan's invisible voice thundering essentially, "AND IF YOU DON'T OBEY EVERY COMMANDMENT SET FORTH, YOU ARE MINE!!!!"
Ugh. Puke. If that isn't fear, shame and guilt, don't know what is....
And the Bible? You think the translation of that is coming directly from God? Read... political/religious agendas/personal agendas/mistranslations, etc. etc. etc. Ahem. etc.
Joan, you got it. The LDS church wants to shove their views down other nonmembers' throats, not the other way around! I could care less what sex Mormons are allowed to engage in with their Mormon underwear... Enlighten me, by the way - do Mormons have to wear that underwear when they do have sex?! How 'bout when you go swimming?
mormons "Practiced polygamy for a short time"???
Your so-called church _popularized_ polygamy in North America, preparing the way for the FLDS (a mormon offshoot) polygamy mess in Texas today.
Mormonism was started by an unemployable wallet-shark, magic-man, and pantie-diver.
Do not look for "morality" (or ethics for that matter) in mormonism ...
the damage the LDS church has done and continues to do to their gay members is heinous and egregious, much more sick and disgusting than, Oh my dear God, "deviant, immoral sex!" Ouch. Try it, you may like it!
The brainwashing the church does to its STRAIGHT members (i.e. 18-yr-old shallow, narrow-minded thought-controlled activist), is more deviant than any sex between a gay couple. Yes, Virginia, real love CAN and DOES exist in such relations! OMG! really?!
By the way, Beth, in Bill Nigh's world, he DOES speak for God! Serious. (wonder what a psychiatrist would have to say about that?).
Well Bill Wiggins, since the Bible (Leviticus)calls same sex an abomination, lets see how YOU fare on some of the other rules in Leviticus because, after all, if you follow one, MUST follow them all:
1. Do you work on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states you should be put to death.
2. Do you like shellfish? Eating shellfish is an abomination (Lev. 11:10)
3. Check out your haircut - hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27.
4. Do you violate Lev. 19:19 by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend)?
The Mormon Church was against Civil Rights in the 60's and the ERA in the 70's. Is anyone surprised they want to prevent gay men and women marrying?
I find the attempts of the Mormon church to define marriage for our society ludicrous. The Mormon church still believes in plural marriage, if not on earth certainly in heaven. The past leaders/prophets of the Mormon church even condoned and encouraged women to practice polyandry ( multiple husbands) so they could have them as plural wives even though these women were already legally married. Several of the current Apostles of the Mormon church are currently practicing plural marriage according to their beliefs about marriage for eternity. Many Mormons, I personally know, believe that God will command plural marriage/polyandry to be practiced again on earth.
How would plural marriage affect society? I believe it to be extremely detrimental to society, morally demeaning to women, morally confusing and dangerous to children by putting it on equal footing with traditional marriage. Yet, Mormons believe that plural marriage is superior to traditional marriage. It was not that long ago that the members of the Mormon church were discriminated against, and even imprisoned for breaking the laws of the land, in continuing to exhibit and practice immoral multiple partner attraction. For the Mormon church to impose its view and definition of marriage on our society is extremely dangerous!
You should do your homework on the doctrines and practices of your own church before you start throwing stones.
winey observes: The Mormon Church was against Civil Rights in the 60's and the ERA in the 70's. Is anyone surprised they want to prevent gay men and women marrying?
Even the Catholic church opposes gay/lesbian marriage.
And they opposed the formation of other churches, the idea that the Earth was not the center of the Solar system, and indeed, the Universe itself.
Understanding takes time, but it does come.
Perhaps the worst thing you can do to promote understanding is to try and force Yours on the unwilling, as the Spanish Inquistion tried to force it's 'understanding' on those who they thought were in need of it.
Gandhi spoke quite eloquently on the matter.
Lora Singer asks how we fare against Leviticus's Laws:
1. Do you work on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states you should be put to death.
kewl! Going to church is too much work for me on the Sabbath...
2. Do you like shellfish? Eating shellfish is an abomination (Lev. 11:10)
No Prob.
Never saw a shellfish I wanted to eat.
3. Check out your haircut - hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27.
I've hated haircuts since I was 6 years old! I'd be sitting on it if it weren't wirey and prone to break off before it gets there.
4. Do you violate Lev. 19:19 by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend)?
You sure won't catch me in Spandex!!
With our myriad of opinions, philosophies and religious points of view we are over looking how the media promulgated propaganda has blind sided society with carefully crafted ideas. We have come to believe and accept the thought that same sex is a marriage just like the marriage of a man and a woman which was designed before the wheel was ever invented.
Same sex male and female organs CANNOT perform natural sexual intercourse with one another and neither can they produce any natural off spring. Society has been dumbed down to accept things which are even contrary to nature itself. Same sex genitals cannot produce children no matter how much we are socially engineered to accept politically incorrect deviant ideas. As a society, we are not to hate or harm any one who is practicing something that is different from the natural forms of life which is spontaneous and does not need political interference and/or moral enforcement. Neither liberal nor conservative ideas are the answer to the social problems of society which is being turned up side down.
If two men or woman have a desire to live with one another it is a civil union because it does not fit into any other forms of natural life on this earth.
Jonah, if children is the only purpose of marriage, then why do we let postmenopausal women get married? Shouldn't there be an age limit?
I love it when an idiot tries to approach their bigotry 'logically'. Good one, Jonah.
You are missing the point.
1. Do you work on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states you should be put to death.
Is using the remote to bounce between football games "work"?
How 'bout going out to the kitchen for another beer & turkey sandwich?
Am I to be stoned to death?!?!
[Call up in your mind, if you will, the 'Stoning Scene' from Monty Python's "Life of Brian"...]
If it isn't on file there, you can find it here:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNeq2Utm0nU
Hmmm... sounds like you have been to the Temple. Either you have been excommunicated or saw some sort of anti-mormon film. Personal spiritual insight is what it is. If you are gay and want to practice marriage (be misrable like all the married heteros, gotta love Kinky Friedman!)go for it. Its a free land. Change the law and get married. But don't be angry about others excercising their freedom to oppose your choice. I don't know any LDS Bishop that would preform a same sex marriage, and its their choice. I do believe that human beings should treat each other with civility and charity. If religious straights would have been truly Christ like and allow gays & lesbians their freedom of choice it would render #8 moot... but that didn't happen. I can tell you that I don't believe in same sex marriage for myself. If there are people that don't believe in it, and if #8 dosen't pass, live with it. If you want people to think that having sex with garments/clothes on is kinky, well I have a pretty good idea that there are all sorts of kinky things that can be done while mattress dancing. Garments don't need to be worn while swimming... but I think you know that all ready. As for a belief in Satan as well as God/Goddess, you can pray about it. Belief is a choice, and to me my belief is something that is sacred, not secret.
We have a moral obligation in the salvation of California. The decline of society from homosexual debauchery should be evident by just reading the newspaper. We have to get our moral house in order, before we can stop the wall street greed that caused home foreclosures and depleted retirement savings.