- ‹ previous
- 452 of 8902
- next ›
Clinton Compared Gore to Mussolini?
As I noted yesterday, the new book on Bill Clinton, based on taped conversations he had throughout his presidency with Taylor Branch, a Pulitzer Prize-winning author and FOB, is loaded with intriguing and juicy passages about the Clinton years (like Hillary Clinton dumping on Sally Quinn because Quinn was spreading the rumor the First Lady had been caught trysting with a female veterinarian in a White House bedroom). But perhaps the most fascinating subplot of the 707-page tome is the relationship between Clinton and Al Gore. The book details the now-famous conversation the two had after the 2000 election, an encounter that was both heated and weird, with each man caught in a different view of reality about that election and other matters.
Now that I've had more time to peruse the book, I've come across other passages that illuminate the tensions and affections these pols shared.
* Describing one interview in which Clinton was evaluating Gore's campaigning during the 2000 election, Branch writes, "Gore lacked confidence in a light touch. Whenever he tried to be aggressive, said Clinton, Gore could come off ponderous and harsh, like Mussolini." Mussolini? That's harsh.
* During a "stressful consultation" between the two men when Gore was running for president, Gore, as Clinton recalled to Branch, told Clinton that "he, Gore, was a good politician, elaborating that he meant good on the policy, and also good on the politics, but admitted that he did not instinctively blend the two. Gore said he had to think about it, and Clinton thought this was pretty close to the bone. As a policy person, and a government person, Gore would make wise choices. He had the stuff to be a great president."
So Clinton compared his veep to a fascist Italian dictator, but believed he could be a great president, and Gore realized that his major deficit was integrating the policy wonk and the politician within him. What I'd like now is to see Gore's side of the tale. Or perhaps a book just on what went on between these two guys. Mr. Vice President, where are your memoirs of the Clinton years?
You can follow David Corn's postings and media appearances via Twitter.
it seems to me you are
it seems to me you are giving a sensationalistic overinterpretation of what clinton said.
from the passage you quote, it appears it compared his public performance style to that of mussolini, not his persona, politics or ideas.
being compared to a dictator is never good, but i think you are misrepresenting what was said.
it seems to me you are
Agree with the comment made before mine. It's a pity that correspondents/reviewers/writers/ with an agenda or poorly-developed analytical skills comment on events. Often, they (like the writer of this article) assign imaginary motives when the events themselves clearly don't support them. It's a shame that such writings and views get a public forum.
"So Clinton compared his
"So Clinton compared his veep to a fascist Italian dictator, but believed he could be a great president"
David Corn you are one of the best in a world dominated by retards or paid off PR hucksters. However your logic here is not impressive. Clinton did not compare Gore to Mussolini he said (according to Taylor Branch and your reporting) "Gore lacked confidence in a light touch. Whenever he tried to be aggressive, said Clinton, Gore could come off ponderous and harsh, like Mussolini...” He obviously his saying Gore lacked the oratory skills to merge policy and politics without seeming "ponderous and harsh". He is merely commenting on his skills as an orator not making a core judgment about his principles or his governing style.
But I am sure you know this but your blog post wouldn't get as many hits if you didn't sex it up. Maybe you should stick to reporting (you are one of the best) and stay off Hardball (or if you must why don't you try harder at knocking down some of that nonsense). Mathews doesn’t need any help mucking up the national discourse.
Well, we all know that Gore's efforts to be firm & forceful came
Well, we all know that Gore's efforts to be firm & forceful came across as heavy-handed.
But having a crappy campaign style is not nearly the same as being like Mussolini in any meaningful way. Frankly, Gore's major problem was that he was too much of a gentleman in pointing on the major lies, misrepresentations, etc. that W constantly was making.
Gore's major problem was that he's Al Gore
.
L'Obamatized
As bad a Gore might have been as President, he wouldn't have done as much harm to the country as the current occupant of the Oval Office.
Obama's enormous deficits are bankrupting the country and will debase our currency. Intergenerational theft is a poor policy.
You smoothy you
Intent on taking a shot at Obama, you didn't hesitate to go off topic to make your point. I imagine you had a sudden urge to trash talk Obama in the middle of reading a post about something entirely different. But you were so smooth. You started out saying that Gore wouldn't have been as bad as Obama. So, skillful.
Gore and Clinton ARE off topic.
Obama IS on topic.
Now go back to paying attention to boring old fascists who still take up valuable space and pollute the environment after having screwed us all over like Clinton, Bush, Carter, and Bush.
Thank GOD Reagan is dead.
The only good ex president is a dead one.
Exactly... http://www.youtube
Exactly...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXtXOd1RXUA
Clinton's ignorance
The comment demonstrates how ahistorical a-holes like Clinton and Corn are; in terms of personality Clinton was far more like Mussolini than Gore ever was. The closest match to Mussolini, in terms of both personality (malignantly narcissistic ) and political ideology is Obama. Read "Liberal Fascism" by Jonah Goldberg and learn a little history. Then when Corn points out some stupid statement by an ignorant politician and completely misunderstands/misinterprets/misleads with it, you won't be mislead.
Read the book?
Jonah said in the book that Mussolini had support from all over the world and -- get this -- from all parts of the political spectrum, until he began to Nazify Fascism.
Jonah Goldberg?!!
You are actually asking us to read Goldberg's book "Liberal Fascism" to "learn a little history"? Give me a break. Goldberg is no historian, and his absurd thesis would be deplored by just about anyone with professional expertise in 20th century European history. He is simply part of the far-right noise machine, intent on discrediting progressive thought and action in any way he can.
You read too much into Clinton's comment
You read far too much into Clinton's comment.
Mussolini = Gore makes historical sense.
Before Mussolini allies himself with Hitler and lost a war, Western "progressives" (left-wingers) of the 1920s and early 1930s worshiped him because they thought he was engineering a successful transformation of society on anti-capitalist lines. Only Soviet propaganda during and after World War II taught us to think of fascism as "right wing"; in reality, fascism was about the same thing left politics has always preached - the forcible suppression of individual rights by the power of collectives purporting to speak for the collective good.
So equating Gore with Mussolini makes perfect sense - in fact, better sense than Clinton probably admitted to himself at the time.
Right is left
I don't think about Mussolini much. Sixt years, after all, is such a long time. But since the subject was brought up, I appreciate your informing us that he was a left-winger. All this time, I though he was just a dictator. So, thanks. This reminds me of the time I was witness to an explanation that the Unabomber was a left winger. I just thought he was crazy. I learn so much on the Internet.
ROFLMFAO
This is hilarious. Fascism, defined by Mussolini himself as "the melding of state and corporate power", has ALWAYS been the epitome of all things "right wing".
Your ignorance of history is definitely not hidden by your stringent parroting of right wing nonsense.
"Owners of capital will
"Owners of capital will stimulate working class to buy more and more of expensive goods, houses and technology, pushing them to take more and more expensive credits, until their debt becomes unbearable.
The unpaid debt will lead to bankruptcy of banks, which will have to be nationalized, and State will have to take the road which will eventually lead to communism."
Karl Marx, "Das Kapital" 1867
Your blind hatred for the
Your blind hatred for the Right has distorted your view of how Faschism began in Europe. All the movements were Socialist in the beginning and resulted in more deaths than all the "right" movements in the history of mankind.
And when did Clinton ever
And when did Clinton ever meet Mussolini?
He would have if he could have.
http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&um=1&sa=1&q=Alessandra+Mussolini
NSFW, but SFBC.
Bill Clinton was not bad, for a Republican.
Something Stinks!
So, your point is that you
So, your point is that you can't make comparisons like that unless you met the people being compared? Knowledge of history isn't enough, I gather.
Clinton Compares Gore to Mussolini
I guess it has been a while since I read MJ regularly. If this is the kind of "journalism" MJ is doing these days I'm staying away. This is tabloid stuff. A single phrase taken out of context to create a provocative headline and write a story of zero meaning or value.
That's it? No second chance.
You're a hard one to please. One story you don't like and you're headed for the door. I guess you got to maintain standards, huh?
Clinton, Gore, Mussolini et al
Strange comment by Clinton.
Al Gore resembles Mussolini only in being a darling of the Progressives. Mussolini was far more politically adroit and almost certainly a better speaker than the ex-VP.
Obama doesn't resemble Mussolini much, either, except for that Progressive stuff. Obama is far more timorous than Mussolini, and doesn't have Mussolini's intellectual heft.
Resemblance?
I really don't think Gore resembles Mussolini very much. He used to. But he lost some weight and quit wearing double-breasted suits. Gore has more hair.
He should have compared him to LBJ.
Except for one small flaw in the plan . . .
Something Stinks!
Clinton, Gore
The comparison was to Mussolini's oratory style not to the fascist ideology. The fact that you attempt to imply otherwise is what is wrong with journalism today. Complete garbage.
It wasn't that bad.
Read some Joan Walsh, David Corn has a lot lower to sink to match her efforts.
Well, maybe not THAT much lower.
Something Stinks!
mystic
mystic
criticism of gore
"Whenever he tried to be aggressive, said Clinton, Gore could come off ponderous and harsh, like Mussolini"
That's a ridiculous comparison to anyone who is ponderous and harsh", but I detect what in essence was a valid criicism of Gore--that he was stiff and too academic when reproaching something. And why should that be a negative? If you extrapolate that to a severe critique of the American psyche in general: That honesty and decency (which Gore always presented) is a sign of weakness, I think that assessment has borne the American image ill. Americans are more impressed by fraudulence which is seen as a sign of being macho. Charisma and other superficialities are considered more important than policy, and we are in an abysmal mess as a result. Even with Obama, it was his charismatic demeanor that won us over, and he turned out to be a carbon copy of Bush minus the beer.
"Ponderous and harsh"
As I recall the three Gore-Bush debates, and especially the first one, I think "ponderous and harsh" does a pretty good job of describing the way VP Gore came off. I had this feeling that he was expecting to have a knockout moment where his superior intelligence and knowledge would make it obvious that Bush had no business running for President. Instead Gore came off as less likable.
This squares very well with another reported Clinton quote from the book in question -- that Clinton thought Bush had good political instincts, but was unqualified. I'd argue that Gore was very qualified, but did have not very good political instincts. I think that Gore's shortcomings in political instincts were what caused him to mire himself in a mental funk due to the Lewinski scandal and ultimately not beat Bush by enough votes for Florida to not be able to decide the election, albeit it with Supreme Court help.
The point is about the limitations of Gore's political instincts, especially compared to Clinton, who was world-class -- the Mussolini comparison is basically catnip.
Gore, Mussollini? Nah, that's just a smokescreen.
http://obeygiant.com/headlines/obama
There is your Mussolini, simple slogans, charisma, the MSM riding shotgun, corporate fascism, eternal war and fascist iconography.
Just glad they are both gone
Just glad they are both gone and irrelevant. Wish they would fade away and spend the hundreds of millions they made for being "public servants"!!!!!
Gore's Book Title
Gore's book title: "Being There"
Life is like a
a Bill written in Congress with 200 pages of pork tacked onto it.
How utterly stupid. Have you
How utterly stupid. Have you forgotten Gore's awkward stump speeches, his sudden embrace of populist rhetoric, his (ironic) railing against corporate interests? It was a strange campaign, and he ran strangely. To say that he could resemble Mussolini on the stump is not in conflict with noting that Gore -- with his deep understanding of policy and his usually thoughtful and positive agenda -- could have been an excellent president. What are you missing?
Mussolini???
Mussolini was a leader.
Something Stinks!
What about Rufus T. Firefly?
" . . . The last man nearly ruined this place he didn't know what to do with it. If you think this country's bad off now, just wait till I get through with it! The country's taxes must be fixed, and I know what to do with it. If you think you're paying too much now, just wait till I get through with it!"
Remind you of anyone?
No? How about our relations with Iran?
"I'd be unworthy of the high trust that's been placed in me if I didn't do everything in my power to keep our beloved Freedonia in peace with the world. I'd be only too happy to meet with Ambassador Trentino, and offer him on behalf of my country the right hand of good fellowship. And I feel sure he will accept this gesture in the spirit of which it is offered. But suppose he doesn't. A fine thing that'll be. I hold out my hand and he refuses to accept. That'll add a lot to my prestige, won't it? Me, the head of a country, snubbed by a foreign ambassador. Who does he think he is, that he can come here, and make a sap of me in front of all my people? Think of it - I hold out my hand and that hyena refuses to accept. Why, the cheap ball-pushing swine, he'll never get away with it I tell you, he'll never get away with it.
[Trentino enters]
Rufus T. Firefly: So, you refuse to shake hands with me, eh?
[slaps Trentino with his glove] "
Support our TROOPS!
"Here are the plans of war. They're as valuable as your life. And that's putting them pretty cheap. Watch them like a cat watched her kittens. Have you ever had kittens? No, of course not, you're too busy running around playing bridge. Can't you see what I'm trying to tell you, I love you. "
"You're a brave man. Go and break through the lines. And remember, while you're out there risking your life and limb through shot and shell, we'll be in be in here thinking what a sucker you are."
Gore? Who the hell cares about Gore?
Something Stinks!
This is why I'm not renewing my Mother Jones subscription
This is a joke and not journalism. Anyone with half of a high school diploma can read Clinton's quote and recognize he was not comparing HIM (Gore) to Mussolini. He was comparing Gore's TONE, BEHAVIOR, RHETORIC, etc. to that exhibited by Mussolini. This type of headline grabbing does not represent honest or knowledgeable journalism, it represents a lack thereof. When I subscribed to Mother Jones last year I thought it would have thoughtful journalism...this is a PRIME EXAMPLE of how misleading your reporting can be.
I am truly ashamed by this...
yeesh!
note to self: yellow-flag on David Corn.
I want some kind of
I want some kind of explanation from Corn or an editor explaining why they think this kind of misrepresentation is acceptable.
Don't hold your breath.
When the fascists take over a progressive news outlet there is nothing you can do but go with the flow. Then they will start deleting comments that point out the obvious and the place will be flooded with right wing trolls whose comments do not get deleted and finally will be a marketplace for hucksters selling products over the web to the suckers who remain.
Hyper
Corn is infected with the beltway cynicism which makes it a tactical ploy to misrepresent in order to gain attention.
Clinton describing Gore's style as Mussolini-ish?
Yeah I see a lot of people rushing to the defense of Al Gore. Who knows? Perhaps some of them are Gore or Clinton personnel defending their public personas. As for defending Gore; who pretends to be an environmentalist when he at one time advocated during his run for the presidency; the use of spraying pesticides on Columbian rainforests where coca plants were grown to fight the war on drugs, this appears to be a problem. What about Tipper Gore who loves Bob Dylan but wanted to censor Hip Hop in whole, obviously overlooking progressive Hip Hop artists. What about Gore's silence during his VP years about Clinton's continuation of Reaganism cutting social programs, betrayal of unions, and Global Trade liberalization that helped to get us into the mess we are in today economically? The answer for some like myself is that we no longer hold any delusions of a benevolent Democratic Party for poor.
ROTFLMBO!!!
LOLOLOL! I know I probably ought to be ashamed of myself for induging something as gossipy as this, but this is the current fast moving train-smacking-the stalled-MiniCooper from which I can't turn away.
That said, I've got to say 'C'mon, Big Dog!' Mussolini? Really??! LOL! Seriously, I see Big Al in long list of politically ponderous ways, but none of them have quite that fascist a lean. A heftier version of Harry S. Truman, maybe. Even my slow-to-act, patient, overly cautious great Uncle Clarence. But Benito? --uh, not so much, no. That would actually demand an impractical hawkishness that I don't really get from the pragmatic Big Al.
I noticed that this blog
I noticed that this blog entry is now on the home page with the bogus headline under a picture of David Corn. Your deception must have recieved enough notice to be pushed up front. Way to build your brand on such poor work. Are you looking for a job in the "entertainment press"?
ugg bailey button boots
The days is gradually cold,I want to buy some wram boots,that I know
UGG Classic boots,
UGG cardy boots,
UGG Bailey Button boots,
Classic tall boots
Button ugg boots,
UGG Classic short boots,
UGG Bailey Button,
UGG Nightfall boots are good warm boots,but I just need one,can you help me?