"shouldn't we know demand that whites denounce and disown Peck for 'associating' with Malcolm?)"

SB

Shouldn't we NOW . . .

BHO gave a great speech on race, then a great speech on the economy, then a great speech on Iraq . .

All important issues - more important to me than even the specifics of Wrights words. We all know damn well he has been taken out of context.

I hope the conversation will move beyond the pastor and begin to address race.

I find it very interesting that half or more than half of Spanish Americans are voting for Hillary Clinton. From what I have heard it is because they want to show their support and loyalty to the Clintons. Because of the good things Bill Clinton did for the Spanish American during his time as President.

BUT, I personally feel they should support and vote for Barack Obama. Because, during the Civil Rights Movement. African American’s protested and died for minorities to have equal rights in America.

Spanish American’s are the largest and fastest growing minority group in America today. Spanish American’s and Asian American’s have been able to benefit and capitalizing on the American Dream. More so than African American’s

I feel that all minorities should vote for Barack Obama. They would not have the rights they have today, if it was not for African American’s protesting and dieing for equal rights in America.

Spanish American’s, as well as the other American minorities should look at it this way. If Barack Obama wins and becomes our next American President. It will open the doors and increase the chances for minorities of other races to become President one day.

Barack Obama, is ready to be our next President. All he needs is the opportunity to show what he can do. He has been compared to President Kennedy, in having the unique ability to unit people of all races.

“When there is hope in the future. It gives you power in the present”

Have A Gratitude Day,

Dwayne McKinney

Obama Speech On Race (video)
http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_video/main500251.shtml?id=3947978n
Barack Obama's Speech On Race (Transcript)
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/03/18/politics/main3947908.shtml

Pastor Manning tells the truth. WWW.Atlah.com

"Either way, shouldn't we know demand that whites denounce and disown Peck for 'associating' with Malcolm?"

Now, why did you have to add that last sentence? I'm just an old white girl who was feeling warm and fuzzy and yes-we-can-ish and you throw cold water on me.

As an American Christian ("white" still, but someday soon simply "human")I have to point out that being damned for our sins is simply one step on the road to redemption. It's the one right before renouncing our sin.

Don't worry, the last line is just sarcasm. I like this post. It will be interesting to see if there are any revisions of opinion after the speech. Unfortunately, it seems that Americas tribalism, whether based on ideology, religion, or race often prevents us from listening to each other for more than a few seconds. To really understand and appreciate Obama's speech, you have to listen to the whole damn thing and it is 40 minutes.

“Within This America”

We are in the midst of observing something incredibly thrilling and of mammoth historic significance in this country. I predict that future generations and perhaps we, will someday reflect on the Presidential Campaign of Senator Barack Obama, as a secondary story and in truth, that is how it should be.

Several months ago I watched the movie “The Queen” starring Helen Mirren. In my efforts to mentally locate a basis for what I wanted to express in this writing, that film seems great example. In short, from my perspective it is in large part, a film about progress and change. But perhaps more importantly, it is about leadership failing to take the measure of, and to respond to the will of the people. It is a film about blinding myopia and rigid tradition which were the basis for crippled leadership. This column is also about the potential for people, citizens with deep seeded beliefs and dreams having an impact and creating real possibilities.

In spite of my optimism, clearly we cannot predict what further level of success Senator Obama will enjoy through the remainder of his campaign. What I have come to know is that is possible, “a very real possibility” that he may become the next President of the United States. That realization alone, speaks volumes about this country, its citizens and the reality of the American Dream.

As a child I would sometimes rush through the wonderful birthday meal my mother had prepared, only focusing on and anticipating the birthday cake that awaited me. Nearly completely failing to appreciate that two separate events were contained in that year’s celebration. As we continue to go about our work on behalf of our candidate, we should be thoroughly enjoying the “fact” that through this campaign to date, we have already orchestrated what is quite possibly the most significant event in this nation’s recent political history. I for one hope Americans never lose sight of or fail to fully appreciate this. Without question securing the Democratic Party nomination and the White House are further critical goals to remain intently focused on. But for many Americans such a reality is only just becoming fathomable.

Before I continue and in an effort to ensure my past ideological failings are fully exposed, let me share some insight into myself. I am an African American, fifty four years old and a native of Cleveland, Ohio. I am college educated and a retired U. S. Naval Officer and former business professional. In short, politically I am significantly right of Teddy Kennedy and perhaps even Senator Obama. So in truth, had you asked me one year ago if this level of success was remotely possible for this candidate, I would have responded that such a thing was both a pipe dream as well as a dangerous proposition. Let me say that I no longer believe either of the foregoing, and also that I was pointedly wrong. I was wrong in my manner of thinking, and wrong about America. I had mentally fallen victim to visions of the same depressing political paralysis that I had long despised.
.
Media pundits and long time politicians repeatedly tell us that speeches, passion, dreams and movements are not the stuff that political leadership is made of. In my view, one has only to recall even from youthful historic studies, visions of just those things as the basis for garnering support for forming and defending the fledgling United States of America. Not only have the long time political insiders seemingly forgotten this, but they also shamelessly and publicly state their disbelief in the importance and substance of it. I can only imagine that this is due in large part to deeply ingrained institutionalized concepts and political ideology that defy them clear vision of the very America that they have committed themselves to report on or the Americans they profess to represent. Oh yes, our career politicians want us to vote for them but they don’t think we really understand and appreciate their methods. Then selling this hollow notion of experience, while locked in an egotistical comma, failing to respond to our many in citizens living in most every variety despair. The reality is, they don’t fully understand and appreciate that the citizens have lost faith in their ability to adequately examine the needs of the people, or their willingness to even fully grasp and carry out such basic concepts as the “will of the people”. I am genuinely perplexed as to how on a grand scale, American politicians unknowingly wander lost into this unknown place. A place as in the aforementioned movie, where “they simply don’t understand that they don’t understand”.

In the history of this generation there is a new story, not only that of traditional vitriolic words, callous tactics and seedy improprieties which litter the landscape of our political leadership. There is now the far more compelling and intriguing story of the “Children of Light”, the many Americans who have loosed themselves from the grips of fear, myopia, silence and indifference. Citizens who have become galvanized by a purposeful dream and belief in an “America within” with the power to change America throughout.

So many have risen to work together for something wonderful in a unified quest for a new brand of leadership. I am heartened and energized by what I have seen and learned from my country of late. In spite of our many troubles and differences, many still believe there is within our grasp a magnificent reality of untainted leadership, equity and freedom to choose that should be thoroughly considered and fully appreciated. There is a visible movement of the many, the we, who are taking an active stance politically and simply refusing to eat “the devil’s hor dourves”. The diverse and delicately blended we, who are galvanized in casting our votes and having a voice in making our choice for the next President of the United States. We, who are joined in our effort to overturn this nation’s inefficient and rustic political machine.

Certainly, there are many challenges and disagreements to face and battles to fight. But now, no mater how daunting the task or how dismal the outlook, or how deeply painful the scars, I am convinced without question, that “within this America” of today, “there is something greater”.

L. A. Walker

© Leon A. Walker, March 2008

Frankly, I was under the impression that Obama was somewhat a moderate god person. Also, I am under the impression that Hillary is a god person for the sake of politics. All in all, for the better of evolution of us humans, I believe a women would be great. As me for, am secular, a man and mixed.

I think that you are onto something..!!! If you could get both races to stop fixateing on themselves, then maybe we can do something. There is just one problem, Whites don't understand what the deal is with nameing your kids Botswana, Shakarawanabenwana, etc. Whatever happened to Mary, Bill, Lary, etc...?
And blacks will never stop acting like WE, the present day whites, were the slave owners...?
If you can do something about that, maybe then we can get past..OK..?
Oh, and by the way, tell the black kids to be a little more respectful, and not always be obnoxious, and i will tell the white kids to put away the flags.OK?

Bill

ROLAND MARTIN WHITE WASHES WRIGHT & OBAMA

I've always felt that Roland Martin was biased toward Obama. On news programs he always adds some spin to let Obama ... and, now Wright look better. First of all ... CNN's title of the article is 'The Full Story' ... huh uh ... CNN'S full story maybe. Plus, who cares if an ambassador wrote most of the 'chickens coming home to roost' speech. Martin makes a big thing about 'context' ... and, yet the ambassador's context was much different than Wright's ... not to mention, less emotional ... less incendiary ... and, over a period of time, not in a context of speeches that were racially explosive, divisive, anti-American ('god damn America'... the government created AIDS to get rid of blacks ... 911 govt. conspiracy ... etc.) ... and, not after giving Louis Farrakan a lifetime achievement award ... that's context! Personally, I don't need Roland Martin's INTERPRETATION ... Martin's article doesn't justify Obama exposing himself, and his family to Wright's racist associations, and hate speech for over 20 years ... (another aspect of context). As eloquent a speech writer and speaker Obama is ... I think his ambition over shadows his honesty and patriotism ... and, I don't trust him.

One of the things that has always troubled me is that we always talk of racial reconciliation within the context of getting along better with white folks. I think that is nice, BUT WE REALLY need to talk about reconciliation within the African American population. Black folks have had to battle twin demons in this country: one is racism, and the other is self-hatred. Racism is well documented; some forms of it are against the law. Racism is not news. However, it is what we do to hurt ourselves that concerns me the most. The lack of interest so many of our young people show toward education, the crime, the sexual irresponsibility, the huge numbers of our children born out of wedlock, the elevation of lumpenproletariat values, the crabs-in-a-barrel behavior, the religious malpractice, and the cultivated ignorance, intolerance, and close-mindedness… It all add up to a huge mental and spiritual health crisis that will only serve to keep us under, to frustrate our progress as a people. I am glad that Senator Obama gave his speech on race relations. It was a great lesson, unique in American presidential politics, but I am really tired of the poor way we African Americans treat each other. I often reflect on the fact that our ancestors prayed for us, our activists suffered for us, and some of our leaders have died for us, but we often live as though their struggles meant nothing. We have to remember that WE ARE, BECAUSE THEY WERE. We also must remember to honor those to came before us, to keep the faith, and to hold on.

Let me get this straight:

It is alright to talk about the revolution, Lincoln, and Pearl Harbor, but any talk about the Tuskegee experiment, COINTELPRO, or white flight is off limits...

YOU MUST BE OUT YOUR GOD D*** MIND!

Bill Nigh,

I have to remind myself to not let you constantly get my goat. Black people don't name their children, Mary, Bill, Larry etc., because they are white names given us by our former slavemasters!! Duh, you stupid ignorant white man.

brightledge, you are a racist. Confess.

billy joe,

you wish. you wish all African Americans in their frustration with racial inequalities, and ignorance were racist. My grandmother is white, my father native american and african. I was educated around whites and reared around African American. I've been around long enough to know there is good and bad in everything. Calling someone an ignorant white man isn't racist if they're in fact an ignorant white man.

Billy Joe,

Also it seems to me white people don't want to be reminded of their unspeakable past. It doesn't just begin with racism. White's have brought nothing but death, pestilence and destruction where ever they have gone. From the aboriginee people all over the world, to the colonization of more than 3/4 the world, and how this affected the people they subjugated. You'd better do your home work kid. Find out a little bit about the white mans' past.

brightledge, are you a sockpuppet for the "Reverend" Wright?

brightledge, "White's have brought nothing but death, pestilence and destruction where ever they have gone.", Who brought the modern medicine to Africa that saves millions every year? Oh, I am sorry, Pastor Wrights says that the CIA invented AIDS to kill the Africans. I apologize for the CIA inventing AIDS and spreading it. brightledge, you are as rational as Pastor Wright and his student, Obama.

Obama obviously doesn't know Wright from wrong. He may be charming in his speech, but it reminds me of a Black Panter and Muslim vantage point.

I am tired of a victimhood mentality. It produces no positive growth for our country. What somebodys ancestors did to somebody's ancestors is yesterday. My ancestors did not do this and also suffered too. People are tired of the blame game, it is history and needs to stay there. If we want to move towards a unified love and respect for each other, there can no longer be blame or victimhood.

We all create our on reality TODAY.

Excuses for hate and unpatriotic speeches , placing blame on the past, are excuses. This is not leadership.

I am not a Typical white person and resent the inference that there is such a thing. That is racism. I am not afraid of black people. I am afraid of bad people no matter the race.

I cannot vote for Obama.

How is it that in remembering and blaming the ENTIRE white race for the shameful past of slavery, that is is conveniently forgotten that it was black africans who initially captured and sold neighboring black tribes to the white slaver??? Just a curious question...

Brightledge has a point.

For the last, what, couple hundered years it has been whites spreading greed, pestilence and death. Lets look. Internment camps, concentration camps, Jim Crowe, Plessy V. Ferguson, Indian Removal act, Crusades, oh and Manhattan Project? See, we own the majority of the gold, the power and the industry. We pollute and don't care who it hurts. We take and take and take and every now and then return something (like medicine to treat AIDS in Africa, though please note, we sat on that for 20 years too).

I dunno, but as a white guy, I am kinda getting tired of "my group" going around pointing fingers at everyone else.

Time for a courageous conversation. I am a tall (6'4") white, male. I have benefitted from my size, my skin color and my gender.

Have I consciously exploited these things? Nope. But up until the last 15 years of my life, never thought about it either. Time for us white guys to fess up and say, "ya know what? We have been wrong." and do something about it. I understand where BHO is coming from, and frankly applaud his courage.

Let the flames begin.

I'm a white male who prefers to date black females, as such I have a page on a black social site. Never once has anyone baited me.
I think the old adage "If you don't have any thing good to say, don't say anything." works wonders.

I'm an older white female jewish atheist (any combination thereof which would be damned to hell by most of middle america)who would be more than willing to occasionally attend Rev. Wright's church. After reading/listening to the ENTIRE sermon, I found him to be interesting, real, and inspiring. The media, in its infinite non-wisdom, chooses what it wants people to see and hear and the majority of viewers have a collective IQ of about 10 so they swallow these snippets, which never tell the whole story, hook, line and sinker. Both Barack Obama and Rev. Wright got a bum rap.

Joyce- Not sure that it is blaming the entire white race for slavery. I am pretty sure it has to do with failing to realize white priviledge, male priviledge, etc. We have had power over others for hundered of years, have changed the rules to keep others down and refuse to admit any culpability. Remember the Founding Documents? Big debate in the continental congress to make sure blacks could never be a threat to the white majority, hence the compromise of black men counting as 3/5 of a white man. If that is not stacking the deck, and Plessy V. Ferguson, and Jim Crowe and poll taxes and pay toilets and the rest of the crap the powerholders have pulled doesn't deserve an apology from the State (and dominanat power group) not sure what does.

My personal philosophy is more about creating real change, real change in personal responsibility about what our individual and collective experience is - Seeing who we really are, and that we are all part of the whole. What we do to each other we do to ourselves.

The blame and victimhood mentality has no place in this, except to recognize experience embedded in the DNA memories. People like Wright who put out hate and hatefulness, angry thoughts and words that go out to create more of the same, have no place in this kind of change for the people who live in our world.

I cannot see Obama as being in this change place because of his Black Panther kind of thinking. He associated with this in an intimate way by association - he attenting a church for 20 yrs where his spiritual guidance is from a man like Wright who spews hatred and revs up his congregation to go forth with these thought. This has got to be the way Obama views things too, otherwise he would not have sought his sprirtual guidance from this source.

This is not just a matter of having a minister come to a prayer breakfast, or having someone do a speech or endorce you. Wright was his minister where Obama CHOSE to endorce this type of thinking by a long term membership and financial support of this minister's work.

Oprah once attended this church and left it. I think she has move way past this kind of reality frame work. everything I hear from her tells me this is true. She and Obama are not on the same wavelength.

For those who are interested, she is hosting a 10 week session on Monday nights focused on the book "The Good Earth" by Eckart Towlle. If you are interested in a new way of thinking about US, all of US, you may want to participate. It has been underway for several weeks, but you can download the podcasts for free from her site. I understand that over 2 million people have already accessed this.

Eckart Towlle "A Good Earth"

http://www2.oprah.com/index.jhtml

Brianna, I agree with Pastor Wright about Israel being a terrorist state. We should stop sending taxpayer money that is used by the terrorist state to oppress third world people, the Palestinians. Nobel Prize winners, Carter, Bishop Tu tu, and Nelson Mandela, amongst many other Nobel peace Prize winners agree with Pastor Wright on this issue. Let us move on to other issues now.

When peace comes to Israel, peace will come to the world.

There is no doubt Mr. Obama wants to be president. There is no doubt his recent speech was a carefully calculated strategy to further his presidential aspirations. In this he is no better or worse than any of the other presidential aspirants. Herein lies the rub. Obama stakes his claim to fame on not practicing politics as usual. Yet, he acts no differently from any other candidate, and still wants to be treated differently. He asks, please don't ask me any more about my pastor damning America but notice how I can damn Muslims like I was Rush Limbaugh. Yesterday, he was supposed to be Kennedy, today he's Lincoln come back from the grave. Who will he be tomorrow? Who is he really?

billy joe:

Yeah, the "white man" brought medicine to "save" the Africans. Right. We have fought like hell to make them pay the "full price" and won't allow the Africans to manufacture drugs generically so their people can afford them. Now we're acting like we're god or something dispensing these precious drugs by donating some money. And at the same time, inflicting our "white Xtian values" by forbidding discussion of condoms, and other protective means to prevent the spread of HIV/AIDS.

Yeah, right. We cannot seem to deal with malaria, all manner of worms that could be prevented with clean water, and the list goes on.

But at the same time - the "lives we have saved" don't begin to compensate for the millions killed, starved, beaten, imprisoned, raped, and enslaved. We're so enlighted - we can't see beyond the end of our noses to REALITY!

We jump in to save the Kosovar Albanians - but sit idly by while almost a million Africans are slaughtered in Rwanda. As we are now sitting idly by watching the genocide in Darfur. We're sooooo.. good to them Africans!

You make me sick.

It's amazing how preoccupations with racism completely blot out the sexism which is far more insidious and pervasive in this election.

Was this post a praise for Obama for president? I think it was so I will go ahead, I don't copy eubonics too well. Obama is just another puppet of some rich people who want to stay rich. There will be no change with him or any other candidates untill we scrap Capitalism. That is the real problem. Candidates are nothing but puppets controlled by the rich. Don't vote and work for the revolution!

Roe vs. Wade has nothing to do with a woman's right to choose just as the Roman Empire had nothing to do with the spread of Christianity. The past has nothing to do with the present (wink, wink).

It is amazing to me that the negativity that Reverend Wright is portraying is meant to uplift his congregation. Perhaps the negative attitudes African-American children and teens display in school is because they feel that they deserve to be yelled at? I have been a teacher in predominately African American, financially poor schools--needy schools-- failing schools. I will say that the vast majority of teachers in these schools are African-American--and they do yell at the students.

Is Barack Obama different, maybe. He certainly seems to be telling us he is. However, if he allows his children to hear such negative speech, I don't think he is "transcending" race. Isn't Obama supposed to be beyond the usual political fray, I don't think he is showing anything but political posturing: he tried to equate his grandmother and Geraldine Ferraro with Reverend Wright. Wouldn't an exec like Wright be pleased!

Obama may have shown us that he is willing to talk about race. Fine. Many whites who have worked with Blacks see each other as people--good, bad, and ugly! I doubt, however, if White people would be welcome in Obama's church. That is the kind of stuff that has to end.

That's right. Blacks have to accept Whites just as much as Whites have to accept Blacks!

Remember: white/black people do not spend every waking moment thinking how they can hurt white/black people! Most of us have to earn a living!

Peace out, y'all....

I can't understand why Obama talking about race is such a big deal. That's all they do at his church anyway! Only they do it the other way around. I have never been racist, but being a woman of Middle Eastern and Latin American origin, I have suffered extensive discrimination. What bothers me the most about the discussion is that Obama approaches the race issue as if he was innocent in it! He is not, his pastor is not and his church of 20 years is not. Take a look at this and tell me it is not divisive, discriminatory and race oriented.

This is the "Statement of Faith" published in Obama's church's website at http://www.tucc.org/about.htm:

We are a congregation which is Unashamedly Black and Unapologetically Christian... Our roots in the Black religious experience and tradition are deep, lasting and permanent. We are an African people, and remain "true to our native land," the mother continent, the cradle of civilization. God has superintended our pilgrimage through the days of slavery, the days of segregation, and the long night of racism. It is God who gives us the strength and courage to continuously address injustice as a people, and as a congregation. We constantly affirm our trust in God through cultural expression of a Black worship service and ministries which address the Black Community.

The Pastor as well as the membership of Trinity United Church of Christ is committed to a 10-point Vision:

A congregation committed to ADORATION.
A congregation preaching SALVATION.
A congregation actively seeking RECONCILIATION.
A congregation with a non-negotiable COMMITMENT TO AFRICA.
A congregation committed to BIBLICAL EDUCATION.
A congregation committed to CULTURAL EDUCATION.
A congregation committed to the HISTORICAL EDUCATION OF AFRICAN PEOPLE IN DIASPORA.
A congregation committed to LIBERATION.
A congregation committed to RESTORATION.
A congregation working towards ECONOMIC PARITY.

If these people consider Africa the mother land, maybe all of them in that church should return to Africa ... how do you thing they would like it?

I never liked Obama since moment one and, although I loath Hillary, I'd rather vote for her as the Democrat candidate than for Obama. Being able to write well and being a good orator doesn't guarantee a good president.

Yes, I agree we folks too often play the victim role. We have been victimized, BIG TIME, in the past, but in order to move forward we must live in the here and now, AND in the HERE AND NOW if we feel it's Obama or NOTHING, I feel we will get NOTHING. As hard as it is to believe some people just love to lose.

Mar - you are against a church that believes in helping Africa and Africans? Why? How is that racist? Plenty of Latino people in the U.S. only support candidates who are committed to helping Latin American countries and people from Latin American countries. Is that racist? If they speak Spanish and talk about their love of their Peruvian or Columbian homeland would you tell them to go back where they came from? Plenty of Jews in Synagogues around the U.S. talk about how they are committed to helping Israel. Do you think there is something wrong with that? Is it wrong for an Orthodox Greek church to speak out in issues affecting Greece? If they say they consider themselves Greeks and that they love Greece would you tell them "Why don't you go back there then?" Multiculturalism is part of American life for many of us. It seems you are trying to say the Trinity United Church of Christ is racist because it believes in helping its congregants and people like them - that makes no sense to me.

Why do you seem to assume that just because Obama belongs to a church that believes in helping black people and African people that that is what his presidency is going to be all about? Hillary Clinton belongs to a church too, and they believe some things I am sure she personally disagrees with. Remember, in this country we have separation of church and state. I believe people are entitled to worship in private.

Also-Sue-apparently you did not listen to Obama's speech. If you did you would realize he does not have "A black panther mentality" or "a victim mentality". In fact his speech is about getting past both those things. Obama has vehemently denounced the racist and anti-U.S. Government things his pastor has said. But remember when his pastor grew up. Have you ever heard of Cointelpro? How about the Tuskegee Experiments? You might want to look those up. Also, did you know that the same terrorists who bombed us on 9/11 (including Osama Bin Laden) were the ones we propped up to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan in the 80s? Context is everything. I don't agree with what the pastor said but I understand it.

In his speech Senator Obama talked about how both whites and blacks have genuine concerns about how their race is treated and perceived by the other in this country. He said the Reverend Wright was wrong and could not see all the progress that has been made by blacks and between the races since the civil rights movement of the 1950s and 60s. Yes it was a politically motivated speech and one he did not want to make - I wish he didn't have to make it also. The less I hear about "Sexism" and "Racism" or gender and race in this election the better.

The Rev. Wright is an old man who is stuck in the past, but he is also a father figure of sorts to Obama. You ask, how can Obama associate with a man who says such hateful things, for 20 years...how can he expose his children to this? Maybe your view is incomplete. The Rev. Wright may have a black panther/victim mentality in some ways, but many people seem to think that all this church and this pastor is about is attacking the U.S. government and white people. No - the church is mostly about helping people, helping the poor get by, helping addicts recover, helping marriages survive. It is also, like most churches, about holding religious ceremonies like baptisms and marriages. It is NOT mostly about the handful of inflammatory remarks you can see on Youtube made in a handful of the 50+ sermons Rev. Wright delivered every year for decades.

The Reverend Wright is strongly against prayer in schools and other intrusions of the church in public life (unlike some of the religious leaders McCain is working with). He is a staunch supporter of gay and lesbian rights. There are many good things about the guy and when Obama says the Reverend Wright does not hate white people I believe him - Wright may be crazy and he is clearly angry at/distrustful of whites, which makes me uncomfortable, but it doesn't mean he hates all whites.

It is amazing how people just don't have much of a problem with preachers who preach hate against gays and lesbians endorsing Republicans. It doesn't create this kind of a fuss. But an angry black guy really gets people excited. I guess its not hard to see why - most of us are white and only a few of us are gay/lesbian or care about someone who is.

Also, I fail to see how sexism is a much bigger issue in this race than racism. Both are issues and they are different. I don't think one is worse than the other - saying it is strikes me as that "victim mentality" some of us decry. Sexism has definitely hurt Senator Clinton just has racism has hurt Senator Obama. Nobody on Obama's staff has said Hillary Clinton would never get where she is if she weren't a woman or married to Bill Clinton- though plenty of people have said this outside of the campaigns. Of course such statements are sexist nonsense. But If Obama was white he wouldn't have to deal with people like Geraldine Ferraro trying to make his race an issue (and Sen. Clinton standing by as she did so), or Bill Clinton comparing him to Jesse Jackson when the only thing they have in common is they are black candidates who won the black vote in SC (Bill Clinton also won the vast majority of the black vote in SC in 1992-nobody had a problem with that), or Tim Russert asking him if he agrees with Harry Belafonte's criticisms of the Dept. of Homeland Security when Obama has absolutely nothing to do with Belafonte other than that they are both dark-skinned and frizzy-haired.

Also, many black people I have spoken to think Obama might be assassinated - I've even heard some white people say this. I haven't yet met anyone who is particularly afraid for Senator Clinton's life in this election.

People are just too eager to stir up racial resentments in this election. The Reverend Wright is not the black David Duke and Obama is not the Reverend Wright anyway.

I just read the Debra Dickerson piece in full.

"for the love of God stop invoking COINTELPRO (no one's bugging your tired old Third World Students Association meeting) and put your own arguments to the test before convening another kente-cloth laden panel discussion on Tuskegee."

My mistake....Though I do think those topics help us comprehend - but do not justify - Wright's racial paranoia.

I thought Dickerson makes a good point...anyone who actually heard Obama's speech could see he was not just talking to white America - I think that's why some people liked the speech so much. It was NOT victim mentality afrocentrism. Still I wish he didn't have to have a "speech on race".

Brightledge,
LOL...I am a white woman and you are right...ignorant is ignorant, no matter what the color or race.

Obama's speech was one of the best I have ever heard since Bobby Kennedy's when MLK was murdered....the other one was Obama's speech at the Democratic convention.

lokywoky hussein said "but sit idly by while almost a million Africans are slaughtered in Rwanda. As we are now sitting idly by watching the genocide in Darfur." Africans will be Africans. Just imagine what they would do if they had nuclear weapons. You wouldn't need the CIA plot to put AIDS into Africa.

All things considered, it is a good thing that we are again advancing the discussion on the issue of race in the United States. Shoghi Effendi referred to racism as "the most challenging issue" facing Americans. The unity of this republic, and really, the unity of the planet depend upon all of us addressing this issue in a compassionate, understanding, thoughtful, fair-minded manner.

Well, I have to say I'm shocked and amazed and just a little appalled, after reading this post and posters. Not ONE of you mentioned the half of US WHITE people that helped free the slaves! They darn sure couldn't have done it for themselves! My ancestors, and THEIR ancestors must be spining in their graves. If I were Sen. Obama, I would not have chosen to use rascism as a 'subject' in my speech, but it does prove to me that if he deemed it important enough to speak on it; it may be worse than we thought. Personally I've lived among and experienced rascism from both blacks and whites, and I have to say: It ain't pretty.
My experiences have always been that what you focus on is what you get, 99.9% of the time. Have a great day.

It's not amazing that out of hundreds of Rev. Wright's sermons, parts of sentences were cherry-picked to give the impression that he is preaching hate, damning America and "spewing venom". Neither is it amazing that without bothering to investigate the full context of those words certain people are so eager to condemn Wright and Obama. And although rage DOES exist in the black community, much to the surprise of white people it seems, I guess unlike the Jews who will "never forget" we blacks are supposed to just "get over it". Oh and we are supposed to know that feminism trumps undoing the legacies of slavery and racism any day. I almost forgot to ignore the fact that slavery as practiced by the colonialists who purchased from black slave-traders was the more brutal than previously known to humanity.

You should know your history a bit better before you go putting ignorant words to print.

Lee did not "Bolt" from Appomattox. He left in a quite dignified manner:

"At a little before 4 o'clock General Lee shook hands with General Grant, bowed to the other officers, and with Colonel Marshall left the room. One after another we followed, and passed out to the porch. Lee signaled to his orderly to bring up his horse, and while the animal was being bridled the general stood on the lowest step and gazed sadly in the direction of the valley beyond where his army lay - now an army of prisoners. He smote his hands together a number of times in an absent sort of way; seemed not to see the group of Union officers in the yard who rose respectfully at his approach, and appeared unconscious of everything about him. All appreciated the sadness that overwhelmed him, and he had the personal sympathy of every one who beheld him at this supreme moment of trial. The approach of his horse seemed to recall him from his reverie, and he at once mounted. General Grant now stepped down from the porch, and, moving toward him, saluted him by raising his hat. He was followed in this act of courtesy by all our officers present; Lee raised his hat respectfully, and rode off to break the sad news to the brave fellows whom he had so long commanded."

References:
Buel, Clarence, and Robert U. Johnson, Battles and Leaders of the Civil War, Vol. IV (1888, reprint ed. 1982); Grant, Ulysses S., Memoirs and Selected Letters, Vol. I (1885, reprint ed. 1990); McPherson, James M., Battle Cry of Freedom: The Civil War Era (1988).

>>>>no one's bugging your tired old Third World Students Association meeting<<<<

O really...? I wouldn't be so sure...

====

Americans, for all their progress, are socially retarded.

That nirvana where race/religion/gender/sexual preference/social status/weight/looks ...

does not exist. How do I know? For crying out loud! Americans feel they are universally unique in the human race. That somehow what happens in the U.S. will have a different outcome because we are __________ ?

Even if you were Chinese living in China in a home where all of your ancestors lived, there will be other Chinese who will put you down for some social reason or another.

Go to any large Central or South American city where blacks live along Chinese and South Americans.

Do they discriminate? Yes! Do they have prejudice? Yes!

Does their society collapse? No! Does this common human condition hold people back? Some! Those who cling to racism as an excuse for their failures.

Nevermind that! Look at Africa where being a Tutsi (SP) got you killed.

There is race hatred in Africa!

Now grow up people. Stop talking all of this nonsense and get back to work on the real issues.

As far as racism goes, America is doing a great job without Obama's pastor teaching Obama how to lead us to that Nirvana where I gather Blacks lead and whites are the little people? Such nonsense from grown and educated men.

Not very insightful comments on race:

Some societies are more egalitarian than others. Ours is definitely better than some (such as Sudan or China) and worse than others (such as much of Western Europe, which has become much more culturally diverse in recent years). We also have a unique history of racism protected by law for 3/4 of our existence. Of course we will face problems between groups, but we strive to be the best.

"As far as racism goes, America is doing a great job without Obama's pastor teaching Obama how to lead us to that Nirvana where I gather Blacks lead and whites are the little people?"

And...how did you gather that? Such nonsense indeed.

Also it seems to me white people don't want to be reminded of their unspeakable past. It doesn't just begin with racism. White's have brought nothing but death, pestilence and destruction where ever they have gone. From the aboriginee people all over the world, to the colonization of more than 3/4 the world, and how this affected the people they subjugated. You'd better do your home work kid. Find out a little bit about the white mans' past.

==========================
I think that some people just fon't get IT..!!! The key word here is P A S T !!! I could understand if i had owned YOU, but I dind't, and no one else did either. It was such a long time ago, that if YOU can't get over it, then NOTHING will change..!!! DO you finally understand..???
And you better stop getting on the white man for all the worlds ills, the black africans, that you so hold up on high, are chopping off the arms of woman and children TODAY, as you sit in the comfort of your american security, spoiled as you are, and you can't see that [deleted]. Ask someone who is from africa why they behave so..?
OH, i forgot, it is the white mans fault.. HAHAHAHAHA

You are being exposed as a self absorbed JOKE..

Bill...

You are right Abe. Europe is more advanced than we, because like Pastor Wright, they know that Israel is a terrorist state and the EU has condemned Israel as such. When will America wake up to the wisdom of Pastor Wright and the EU?

To Abe,

I do consider myself a citizen of the world. I have lived in three countries so far and I am not even 50. So there. I have never voted in my life, but I have paid my taxes religiously to all these countries that don't consider I have the right to vote. I don't belong to any one country. I don't complain about the country am in and I have never worked for the cause of my country of birth. I find it an hypocrisy to leave in a foreign country and complain against it and then support all the causes of your original country. It doesn't matter which one is your country. If you love it so much, if it is so superior to the one you live in, then move back there.

Now, I am talking about foreign born people. But this church is a different story. These are people born here whose relatives came from Africa several generations ago. They are not Africans, they are Americans, with all the advantages that implies. Africa is a very poor continent, plagued by lack of resources for everybody, wars, poverty, corruption, indeed, not a very nice place to live in. Africa is not the ideal continent and Africans are not the ideal people. Neither is America and Americans. The fact of the matter is that black people are better of in the USA than in many other countries - but they still complain! In Brazil there was also slavery, yet blacks over there don't feel they are better than whites because of that and they don't have organizations (religious or not) that promote the interestes of the African continent or any particular African country.

Furthermore, this is a church and I am an atheist who hates all churches and religions, since in my eyes and experience are all a manipulative way of control of the masses. If you have more than two brain cells, you cannot stomach fairy tales and if you want to be the president of the US, then you MUST use your brain to make good decisions BEFORE you ever imagine yourself in that exalted position. If you are so stupid that you associate with a radical and racist church, then it is hard to avoid judging you a little on the light side of the intelligence spectrum.

I completely agree with Wright on the issues. What I don't agree with is his delivery, the environment in which he chose to deliver those speeches (they are not sermons), and how hypocritical it is that he is against prayers in schools, but has no problem delivering a politically charged, endorsement speech in his church??? But mostly I don't agree with Obama talking about America's racism when in fact he belongs to a racist church - for 20 years, no less! It just doesn't make any sense.

Lastly, Wright and this church are very clear regarding their position toward Israel. They consider it a terrorist state and they consider their agressions an opression just as bad as slavery was to the black race. How come then now Obama is all sweet to Israel? So, one of the two, either Obama dumped his allegiances of 20 years (which is not a good thing) just because he wants to be elected president, or he is telling lies for the same reason. Either way is not a good sign of things to come.

Abe says "It is amazing how people just don't have much of a problem with preachers who preach hate against gays and lesbians endorsing Republicans. It doesn't create this kind of a fuss. But an angry black guy really gets people excited. I guess its not hard to see why - most of us are white and only a few of us are gay/lesbian or care about someone who is."

I think you are wrong on this point as well. Aparently, the biggest problem is that Obama is the front runner of the Democratic party! We know what pieces of [deleted] those republicans are and the "pastors" they associate with, we despise them, criticize them and we know we are in this mess (including Israel and Iraq) because of their fundamentalist beliefs. We don't need to talk about it because all of us agree. But Obama is different. He was offering hope, change, etc. and then all of a sudden it turns out he is also associated with a radical cleric, is also a liar when is convenient to him, and is a politician whose best quality is that he is a good orator! Gee, this country has multimillions of people, couldn't you find somebody better than these two creeps?

The way Hilary Clintion's machine is working-to me is foul and distastful.. I know this sort of stuff has gone one before in American politics but I expected more. Now I am torn as to whether I should vote for Obama in the primary -as a independent and if Hilary gets the nomination due to her ruthless machine, which I see no different than that of the Bush machine and what they did to Kerry; I believe I will not vote in November, and if I decide to not vote in the primary but vote in November as a independent, I will-as a protest vote, vote for Nader..Judas or not!

America has been the best country on earth for black folks. It was here that 600,000 black people, brought from Africa in slave ships, grew into a community of 40 million, were introduced to Christian salvation, and reached the greatest levels of freedom and prosperity blacks have ever known.

Wright ought to go down on his knees and thank God he is an American.

Second, no people anywhere has done more to lift up blacks than white Americans. Untold trillions have been spent since the '60s on welfare, food stamps, rent supplements, Section 8 housing, Pell grants, student loans, legal services, Medicaid, Earned Income Tax Credits and poverty programs designed to bring the African-American community into the mainstream.

Governments, businesses and colleges have engaged in discrimination against white folks -- with affirmative action, contract set-asides and quotas -- to advance black applicants over white applicants.

Churches, foundations, civic groups, schools and individuals all over America have donated time and money to support soup kitchens, adult education, day care, retirement and nursing homes for blacks.

We hear the grievances. Where is the gratitude?

If you are going to cut and paste PJ Buchanan you should give him attribution. Shame on you

Their is one thing i can say about foxnews and that is that at least you can see them coming.They donot make it a secret that they are the apologist for the racist status quo.They donot throw a rock and hide their hand.It is not a secret that they fear obamas' good looks,intellect and charisma.Politics however,does make strange bedfellows as the saying goes,fox is sleeping with hilary.As far as the other networks are concerned,well they throw rocks and hide their hands and sleep with the fox network behind close doors.Obama you will need DIVINE intervention in order to deal with a dealer who stacks the deck with at least a 400 year head start and unfortunately still has to cheat.

I'm trying to understand why everyone want people of african descent in america to forget about the hundreds of years of injustices imposed upon them?but when the jews constantly bring up their situation in GERMANY its alright.Do the jews have a legitimate beef? well if they do,then so do we.Some forces in this nation are afraid to have a honest,truthful and open discussion about the injustices that occured in this nation.These people need to get a grip on reality because these acts of injustice are not made up.Come on now rev. wright didnot invent these realities.Truth crushed to the earth will always rise.We have to eventually deal with the race issue honestly and being in denial will not solve anything.

Brightledge:
You wrote:
"white people don't want to be reminded of their unspeakable past."
Here is a major part of the problem.
I don't have an "unspeakable past" and I know of few White people who do. Black Africans also were involved in the slave trade and my ancestors were no where near either group. Even if they were, it is patently UN CHRISTIAN to blame the successive generations for even real crimes, let alone emagined (or projected) ones.
The whole concept of a "Black Church" or a "White Church" is also un Christian, by its core defination. Christians are all brothers and sisters, so the whole argument is bizzare to the max. Pastor wright SHOULD HAVE been quoting Jesus' rules against permiscuity--instead of blaming venerial illness' on "cacausian" science.

You are right Trollstein.

I try my best not to use words like black and white when describing people.why?because colors donot accurately describe or characterize a nation.So called "whites are actually European descendants,so called "blacks are of African descent and the Asian population whom i respect so much because they never go around calling themselves brown or yellow.Asians actually prefer to be refered to by their national orgin,i.e. China,India,Iran etc.my point is that until we stop using color to describe other human beings this racist stuff will continue to perpetuate itself.The so-called"black church is indirectly depends on how you look at it is actually a creation of rejection of one group of human beings by another group of human beings.Namely humans from Europe rejecting the another part of the human family that GOD created namely African people.Now we can act like that this didnot happen or we can face it,and deal with it or we can keep making excuses and be intellectually dishonest,which will it be?Obama in all honesty didnot start the racial stuff,you can talk about his pastor ,but he himself has stayed on point about what the nation needs.The times that he has had to speak about race is only when other forces instigated this subject because these racist forces need obama to be a racial canidate as to play the fear card.See i bet that these forces didnot think that anyone would see through their hatefulness.GOTCHA

I try my best not to use words like black and white when describing people.why?because colors donot accurately describe or characterize a nation.So called "whites are actually European descendants,so called "blacks are of African descent and the Asian population whom i respect so much because they never go around calling themselves brown or yellow.Asians actually prefer to be refered to by their national orgin,i.e. China,India,Iran etc.my point is that until we stop using color to describe other human beings this racist stuff will continue to perpetuate itself.The so-called"black church is indirectly depends on how you look at it is actually a creation of rejection of one group of human beings by another group of human beings.Namely humans from Europe rejecting the another part of the human family that GOD created namely African people.Now we can act like that this didnot happen or we can face it,and deal with it or we can keep making excuses and be intellectually dishonest,which will it be?Obama in all honesty didnot start the racial stuff,you can talk about his pastor ,but he himself has stayed on point about what the nation needs.The times that he has had to speak about race is only when other forces instigated this subject because these racist forces need obama to be a racial canidate as to play the fear card.See i bet that these forces didnot think that anyone would see through their hatefulness.GOTCHA

"I am tired of a victimhood mentality. It produces no positive growth for our country. What somebodys ancestors did to somebody's ancestors is yesterday. My ancestors did not do this and also suffered too. People are tired of the blame game, it is history and needs to stay there. If we want to move towards a unified love and respect for each other, there can no longer be blame or victimhood."

F@#$ you!

Do you think three quarters of the world beg to be victims of occidental tyranny that honkies the world over want to pretend does not exist because it offensively embarrasses the intended lily white victors and beneficiaries of manefest destiny mandated by presumptuously alleged Divine Providence? In order to move forward, the whole world will first need to resolve this mess. It is not going away because this generation of beneficiaries is embarrassed by how they actually came to enjoy the privileges still denied the rest of us.

Hey Rage,

You seem to have a GREAT inferioraty complex..? You think that something people did 100 yrs ago, somehow imapcts how you and your kids behave in school..? How people treat you in public..? How 80% of your young ladies get knocked up without marriage..? How the crimes commited by sooooo many of your young men have landed 1 in 9 of them in the judicial system, since they are trying to make an easy buck, instead of WORKING for $'s..?
How about getting with the program and behaving in school, getting married, dress appropriatly, try to mix with EVERYONE who is a good citizen, and STOP blameing all your troubles on people who lived 100 yrs ago..?

What say you..?

BIll

rage, please do not use the H word. It detracts from any intellectual discusssion that you may be attempting to make. Remember that this is an intelletual site.

"You seem to have a GREAT inferioraty complex..? You think that something people did 100 yrs ago, somehow imapcts how you and your kids behave in school..? How people treat you in public..? How 80% of your young ladies get knocked up without marriage..? How the crimes commited by sooooo many of your young men have landed 1 in 9 of them in the judicial system, since they are trying to make an easy buck, instead of WORKING for $'s..?"

F@#$ you Bill!

You prove my point! It's all by design. Of course, the privileged honkey beneficiaries of honkey colonialism will never see that.

Rage,

Someone once said, "the last refuge of the inferior masses is Name Calling."
Maybe you should try a Rational & Intelligent response..?

If you are able...?

Bill

Rage,get on You Tube and listen to some of Pastor Manning's sermons about our beloved Obama. He is a Black Pastor that really understands the Black situation.

rage, cheer up. America has been the best country on earth for black folks. It was here that 600,000 black people, brought from Africa in slave ships, grew into a community of 40 million, were introduced to Christian salvation, and reached the greatest levels of freedom and prosperity blacks have ever known.

Wright ought to go down on his knees and thank God he is an American.

No people anywhere has done more to lift up blacks than white Americans. Untold trillions have been spent since the '60s on welfare, food stamps, rent supplements, Section 8 housing, Pell grants, student loans, legal services, Medicaid, Earned Income Tax Credits and poverty programs designed to bring the African-American community into the mainstream.

Governments, businesses and colleges have engaged in discrimination against white folks -- with affirmative action, contract set-asides and quotas -- to advance black applicants over white applicants.

Churches, foundations, civic groups, schools and individuals all over America have donated time and money to support soup kitchens, adult education, day care, retirement and nursing homes for blacks.

We hear the grievances. Show some gratitude rage dear

Billy Joe stole that last bit of brilliance from Pat Robertson, and it was played on the Stephanie Miller show recently. I couldn't believe what I was hearing then, and I can't believe that I'm seeing it regurgitated by the right wing blow hards on this blog. What a bunch of tools.

Why Obama won't separate from his pastor?

Although I am socially conservative, I must admit, after reading Barack Obama's speech, that he is the most honest of any of the presidential nominees.
Barack Obama recognizes that there are contradictions in all of us, and that includes his pastor Jeremiah Wright. I was confused as to why Obama still associated with Wright and had suspicions about Obama's own motives. Not any more.
Obama understood that Wright's rantings were based on his generational experiences and that his old pastor simply refused to forgive America regardless of how much racial progress had already been made.
However, all of Wright's rantings did not take away the positive characteristics that Obama observed in Wright. As Obama said, Wright helped him enormously in his faith and that on a personal level Wright was always gracious to others regardless of race, whites included.
An analogy I can think of is if you had an aunt who helped you a lot in life but because she was raped by a man early in her life she turned out to have a very strong anti-male sentiment even if on a personal level she was friendly towards men. Would you have separated from your aunt over that? What would have been the use of pulling her to the side and talking to her when you knew that what she felt was not based on reason but pure emotion?
Barack Obama has rightly and publicly rejected his old pastor's prejudices. Considering the context of his old pastor's experiences we should not have to demand that Obama totally separate and disassociate with him. We know where Obama stands and Obama is not racist or anti-American.
I encourage everyone to fully read Obama's speech. It's available on the Internet. An honest man he is.
Obama is not just rhetoric as many have so ignorantly dismissed him. He has very good and specific, detailed plans and ideas for the economy and foreign relations, although these do not receive the same public and media attention

Do we really need a dialogue on race? To what aim? We already know how Whites feel about us. Most everybody hates Black folks - Latins, Jews, Indians - for whatever reason (perhaps to become better citizens, to quote Richard Pryor). So what. They always will; the only thing that changes is the excuse. I had a young white man from Queens tell me he hated Blacks. When I asked him why, he replied that "..they all think everybody is racist against them..". Hmmm.. But maybe we do need to hear from the other side, because we can't see ourselves like other people see us. When I go to my old neighborhood and see hundreds of young Black Men wearing tee shirts that pronounce 'Rats Get Poisoned', I wonder where those bright Black scholers who attend the Black State of the Union are - nowhere to be found.

So if I understand this post correctly, blacks and other minorities should vote for BHO simply because he's (half) black, and his victory would be good for minorities. And this is not racist thinking how? Just *think* what the reaction would be if someone suggested that whites vote for HRC or JM just because they're white and that would be good for whites...

The point of Barack's speech is that history is far more complicated than “blacks did this / whites did that”. Beyond simply overcoming the distraction of polarizing generalizations, he had the insight to argue that the problems people care about are universal. We often bypass a serious discussion by scapegoating racial discrimination, in whatever form, as the cause of real problems.
It would be simpler to just describe these problems in terms of what they actually are – or better yet, what we want to work for: justice; social & economic equality; human dignity. It’s no great secret that people get pissed off when they feel they’re being treated unfairly. Even monkeys get pissed when they’re treated unfairly – and they’re monkeys. Typifying people based on their skin color, their parents’ origins, or anything else they can’t make a choice about is a surefire way to inspire rage. I recommend giving that up – it’s not helping you, either.
It’s too easy to think that what Rev. Wright said was controversial because he is in fact dark-skinned (black, if you like to think of him that way). Try imagining that a light-skinned man said America had 9/11 coming because of our sins (maybe a TV or radio pundit, or to extend the analogy, a pastor or reverend). Would that upset you? Then imagine that a white presidential candidate, rather than someone who identifies as black, publicly endorsed that man. Would that bother you as much as the proximate cause of Barack’s speech clearly did?
If we are a little more honest with ourselves, and forget about what color skin Rev. Wright wears, we may realize he’s not saying anything controversial (even if you take it out of context). The Trinity United Church of Christ’s mission statement was quoted and an interpretation of racially polarizing values was suggested. I would suggest that if you change the words “Africa” and their cognates to those of your identified history, you will find a shared story there. It is a story of oppression and freedom, of violence and hope, incredible suffering and the power of human dignity. It’s exactly the same story we tell on the paper in our wallets, “E pluribus unum.” There’s a whole book in the bible about slaves who were saved from centuries of oppression to become a blessed people. There are many cultures I’m unfamiliar with, but I’m sure that all of us Americans share that same story. It’s not about race – it’s about justice.
When we work for justice, we don’t have to talk about race. There is no “you blacks,” “you whites,” “you Jews and gays and you liberal neocons.” There are no names or labels – there’s just Us.

You Say What? is misguided

Yes Blacks have reasons to be upset. The way the US has historically dealt with Blacks have created pathological conditions in our community. But let us not absolve ourselves (Blacks) and our complicity in the perpetuation of our present state.

The Problem with Rev. Wright is that he is not creating an honest dialogue about the problems in the Black community. He has appealed to our most base nature. He uses his most important position on the pulpit to perpetuate theories about how White people are trying to destroy Blacks (see AIDS comment) and to stroke Black paranoia and misgivings about our country.

These falsehoods do not uplift or educate his congregation. His statements may be offensive to some but more importantly they are ignorant and untrue. We don't need people speaking untruths to vulnerable and uninformed people. Remember Bush's justifications for the Iraq war.

Obama's problem is that he is educated and he is supposed to be sensitive to these comments whether they are made by Don Imus, David Duke and yes even Rev. Wright.

Someone long ago should have pulled Rev. Wright to the side and at least told him to check his facts, or tell him that he is acting irresponsible or simply tell him to shut up.

Do I think Obama should tarnished by this... not really. Obama's speech on race was inspiring and historical. That is the type of speech Wright should have been giving.

I wish and hope that Obama's speech it is enough to quell the Rev. Wright controversy and truly opens a dialogue on America's racial problems.

But we are fooling ourselves if we think that this issue is going away and that Rev. Wright comments won't stick to Obama like hot grits.

He is not going to win the general unless he comes up with a better explanation ... it simply doesn't fly that he wasn't there and he didn't know. And had he known he would of left the church. People talk about ministers sermons all the time, he would have heard something.

Obama didn't wish to know.

I suspect that Obama might be like many people who go to church. They go out of tradition, out of habit, to hear the choir, for the different community programs, for the fellowship and really don't pay much attention to the rantings of the minister. Many of us sleep during the sermon.

Church is more about socializing and being with a group of people who form a support system. And let us be honest a political base (if you are an ambitious aspiring politician).

It is unfortunate because I do think Obama may be that transformative politician that comes around every other generation.

That new McCain ad said it all. It is not subtle at all. It is actually unintellectual and demeaning but it is effective.

And yes that ad will resonate. When people go to the ballot box, they will pick McCain.

This is really unfortuante when it is clearly obvious that McCain does not grasp the issues (foreign and domestic) and really has no new ideas or visions for making our country better.

Sad Democrat

Isn't it strange that those who protest against the Reverend's "racist" remarks are so willing to perpetuate racial stereotypes of their own?

Right on! Reverend Wright! Right? Or should America just forget the last 300 years? Whoops, compassion freeze, sorry. I must have left my humanity in my other pants.

By now Reverend Jeremiah Wright’s sermons have been extracted from their context and examined as if they comprised that totality of his sermons and discussed (dissected) to the point of distortion. But more important than that, they have been extracted from the history from which the Black community’s anger was born (had its birth).

Yes, whites admit that in the 1860 census 3,953,696 blacks of the Southern population in 1860 were the slaves of 385,000 “owners.”

The 1860 census showed the following:
Total number of slaves in the Lower South : 2,312,352 (47% of total population).
Total number of slaves in the Upper South: 1,208758 (29% of total population).
Total number of slaves in the Border States: 432,586 (13% of total population).
The total number of slave owners was 385,000

But didn’t the white population also freed these slaves? In fact, didn’t they fight a war to free them, and once they freed them, didn’t they give them the right to vote so they could exercise self-determination. After the civil war white America stopped persecuting them, right?

Why is he so upset. After all, the white community said it was sorry. Isn’t that enough for almost two hundred fifty years of institutionalized slavery and another one-hundred fifty years of institutionalized persecution. Gee whiz, you’d think white people had lynched thousands of African-Americans and that the U.S. government had failed to protect them.

“From 1882-1968, 4,743 lynchings occurred in the United States. Of these people that were lynched 3,446 were black. The blacks lynched accounted for 72.7% of the people lynched. These numbers seem large, but it is known that not all of the lynchings were ever recorded. Out of the 4,743 people lynched only 1,297 white people were lynched. That is only 27.3%. Many of the whites lynched were lynched for helping the black or being anti lynching and even for domestic crimes.” Berea College

“The scale of this carnage means that, on the average, a black man, woman, or child was murdered nearly once a week, every week, between 1882 and 1930 by a hate-driven white mob.” Questia Encyclopedia

But the government tried to make it right, right?
“State and local governments in the South did little to curtail lynchings; various laws against mob violence were seldom enforced. Three times (1922, 1937, 1940) antilynching legislation passed the House of Representatives, only to be defeated in the Senate. Although the term has fallen into disuse since the civil-rights movement of the 1960s, similar practices still occur, often classified today as "bias crimes."” Questia Encyclopedia

While lynching is wrong, they had good reasons. They were all for capital offenses, right?

“The accusations against persons lynched, according to the Tuskegee Institute records for the years 1882 to 1951, were: in 41 per cent for felonious assault, 19.2 per cent for rape, 6.1 per cent for attempted rape, 4.9 per cent for robbery and theft, 1.8 per cent for insult to white persons, and 22.7 per cent for miscellaneous offenses or no offense at a 11.5 In the last category are all sorts of trivial “offenses” such as “disputing with a white man,” attempting to register to vote, “unpopularity”, self-defense, testifying against a white man, “asking a white woman in marriage”, and “peeping in a window.””

How could anyone quibble with those obvious death penalty offenses, especially “disputing with a white man.”

The Reasons Given for Black Lynchings

* Acting suspiciously
* Gambling
* Quarreling
* Adultery
* Grave robbing
* Race hatred; Race troubles
* Aiding murderer
* Improper with white woman
* Rape
* Arguing with white man
* Incest
* Rape-murders
* Arson Inciting to riot
* Resisting mob
* Assassination
* Inciting trouble
* Robbery
* Attempted murder
* Indolence
* Running a bordello
* Banditry
* Inflammatory language
* Sedition
* Being disreputable
* Informing
* Slander
* Being obnoxious
* Injuring livestock
* Spreading disease
* Boasting about riot
* Insulting white man
* Stealing
* Burglary
* Insulting white woman
* Suing white man
* Child abuse
* Insurrection
* Swindling
* Conjuring
* Kidnapping
* Terrorism
* Courting white woman
* Killing livestock
* Testifying against white man
* Criminal assault
* Living with white woman
* Throwing stones
* Cutting levee
* Looting
* Train wrecking
* Defending rapist
* Making threats
* Trying to colonize blacks
* Demanding respect
* Miscegenation
* Trying to vote
* Disorderly conduct
* Mistaken identity
* Unpopularity
* Eloping with white woman
* Molestation
* Unruly remarks
* Entered white woman's room
* Murder
* Using obscene language
* Enticement
* Non-sexual assault
* Vagrancy
* Extortion
* Peeping Tom
* Violated quarantine
* Fraud
* Pillage
* Voodooism
* Plotting to kill
* Voting for wrong party
* Frightening white woman
* Poisoning well

“Many of these victims were ritualistically tortured. In 1904, Luther Holbert and his wife were burned to death. They were "tied to trees and while the funeral pyres were being prepared, they were forced to hold out their hands while one finger at a time was chopped off. The fingers were distributed as souvenirs. The ears...were cut off. Holbert was beaten severely, his skull fractured and one of his eyes, knocked out with a stick, hung by a shred from the socket."8 Members of the mob then speared the victims with a large corkscrew, "the spirals tearing out big pieces of...flesh every time it was withdrawn."” The Brute Caricature http://www.ferris.edu/jimcrow/brute/more/brute_page.htm

But white America “kind of” felt it was wrong to lynch but not completely wrong and not always wrong. Sometimes it just cannot be avoided. James Cutler in his 1905 book Lynch expresses white America’s refined attitude that lynchings “can only be justified on no other ground than that the law as formulated and administered has proved inadequate to deal with the situation—that there has been governmental inefficiency...”

What a magnanimous concession. That’s one kind of self-determination; the determination to take the law into your own hands - a right reserved for whites.

How could this magnanimous concession possibly offend Reverend Wright and the Black community? Isn’t it so obviously sound, so obviously white?

Dr. David Pilgrim, Professor of Sociology at Ferris State University, found the following: “In 1921-22 the United States House of Representatives and Senate debated the Dyer Bill, an anti-lynching bill. This bill provided fines and imprisonment for persons convicted of lynching in federal courts, and fines and penalties against states, counties, and cities which failed to use reasonable effort to protect citizens from lynch mobs. The Dyer Bill passed in the House of Representatives, but it was killed in the Senate by filibustering southerners who claimed that it was unconstitutional and an infringement upon states' rights. The following statements made by southern Congressmen during the Dyer Bill debate suggest that they were more concerned with White supremacy and the oppression of Blacks than they were with constitutional issues.

Senator James Buchanan of Texas claimed that in "the Southern States and in secret meetings of the Negro race [White liberals] preach the damnable doctrine of social equality which excites the criminal sensualities of the criminal element of the Negro race and directly incites the diabolical crime of rape upon the white women. Lynching follows as swift as lightning, and all the statutes of State and Nation cannot stop it."

Representative Percy Quin of Mississippi, spoke of lynch law, "Whenever an infamous outrage is committed upon a [Southern] White woman the law is enforced by the neighbors of the woman who has been outraged? The colored people of [the South] realize the manner of that enforcement, and that is the one method by which the horrible crime of rape has been held down wh